Looking for a smart home system. Which equipment should I be interested in?

A warm welcome to you all,

I would like to know what would be the best system for the construction of a new house (i.e. it is possible to lay additional cables). I have read a little bit about Fibaro, but I would prefer everything to be wired with possible wireless functions. I.e. the heart of the system will be a fully wired central unit.


This system would be responsible for control:
Electrical sockets (approx. 30) (I would like to switch off e.g. all sockets or only selected ones from the level of a touch panel, tablet, computer)
Lighting switches (approx. 30)
External roller shutters - Opening/closing
Garage door/entry gate - Opening/closing
IP cameras

Additionally, if possible, it would be nice if the alarm keypad could be excluded and the alarm could be controlled from the position of the touch panel, tablet, etc.

A requirement is a permanently powered touch panel of some kind (to be placed at the door).

In addition to Fibaro, I was also looking at Hager. I would like the system to be reliable. Please advise.

pafcio86 wrote:

Welcome to you all,

I would like to know which system would be best for the construction of a new house (i.e. is it possible to lay additional cables). I have read a little bit about Fibaro, but I would prefer everything to be wired with possible wireless functions. I.e. the heart of the system will be a fully wired central unit.


This system would be responsible for control:
Electric sockets (approx. 30) (I would like to switch off e.g. all sockets or only selected ones from the level of a touch panel, tablet, computer)
Lighting switches (approx. 30)
External roller shutters - Opening/closing
Garage door/entry gate - Opening/closing
IP cameras

Additionally, if possible, it would be nice if the alarm keypad could be excluded and the alarm could be controlled from the position of the touch panel, tablet, etc.

A requirement is a permanently powered touch panel of some kind (to be placed at the door).

In addition to Fibaro, I was also looking at Hager. I would like the system to be reliable. Please advise.

Hello,

And do you know maybe such a smart home system here is the link

...::ASTAT - Smart home / building http://www.astat.com.pl/instalacje/inteligentny-dom

...::ASTAT - BY-ME system http://www.astat.com.pl/instalacje/inteligentny-dom/byme

I had one project together with this company and it is great. If you want to get in touch with a colleague from this company, I can recommend him. Full professionalism in its field.

Take a look at Nexwell's solutions from Wrocław. There you have a complete set of devices from touch switches to all sorts of communication, executive modules - most functions with basic electrical knowledge you program yourself. www.nexwell.eu

Like the predecessor - I recommend Nexo. Also be interested in the Grenton system from Krakow, very cool system.

I would advise you to think about professional equipment dedicated to this type of solution with easy expandability. I would suggest a CUE system. A standard system consists of:
- a central unit
a central unit with a series of ports which communicates with
- modules controlling the electrical equipment in the house (switching of electrical sockets, reaction to the activation of wall switches, stepless regulation of lighting, control of various types of roller blinds, screens, etc.)
- a touch panel (or more than 1)
which features a graphic layout that is designed from start to finish for the installation in question. You can use the panels on offer (wall-mounted, tabletop, table-top, wireless 7" 10" 12" etc. etc.) or a PC, mac, android tablet etc.

In addition to electrical control, it is possible to control devices such as TV, projector, HiFi equipment, (volume control, selection of channels, inputs, etc.) air conditioning, alarm.
Possibility of remote control (via internet) etc.

Please do not hesitate to contact me if you have any questions. I design and install automation systems, I will help within the possibilities.
Regards
Lukasz

kyry1 wrote:

I would advise you to consider professional hardware dedicated to this type of solution with easy expandability....

So according to your colleague the items listed above are not professional? - your statement sounded strange.

kyry1 wrote:

I would advise you to consider professional hardware dedicated to this type of solution with easy expandability. I would suggest a CUE system.

Mate check out, the previous systems that are in the above posts.
Write us what your system has and the others don't (apart from the company name).

Dear colleagues, apropos the question of what CUE has that the above systems do not:
Let's assume that a customer has devices controlled from an IR remote such as a TV, stereo etc. There may be a number of such remote controls. In cue it is possible to implement all these devices into one system and so have all the functions of all the remotes in one touch panel.
2 thing, I didn't go into depth, maybe I'm wrong but I didn't see in the above systems the possibility to control devices via RS232/422 or 485. Most projectors have such ports. Not to mention other devices like multi-room systems, video conferencing, CCTV (that's standard).
As far as roller shutter control is concerned, I have not read whether the executive modules (relays) are programmable. I.e. is it possible to lower or raise a roller shutter from a wall button without the central unit? (I mean the time delays between switching up/down so as not to damage the roller shutter motor)
All this is possible with the CUE (kju). Not to mention that the system is equipped with analogue ports, digital ports, GPIO, voltage/current inputs/outputs, the use of which can be unlimited.
The price is also no longer as prohibitive as it was a dozen years ago.
Regards

kyry1 wrote:

Dear colleagues apropos the question of what CUE has that the above systems do not:
Let's assume that a customer has devices controlled from an IR remote such as a TV, stereo etc. There may be a number of these remote controls. In cue it is possible to implement all these devices into one system and so have all the functions of all the remotes in one touch panel.

Do you have at least one customer who, instead of using a remote control, controls the TV from an LCD keypad somewhere on the wall ?
Here you have a solution that has been available from Nexo for several years:
http://www.nexwell.eu/produkt/nxw296-modul-ir-tukan

kyry1 wrote:

2 thing, I didn't go into depth, maybe I'm wrong but I didn't see in the above systems the possibility to control devices over RS232/422 or 485. Most projectors have such ports.

So are you saying that any device connected to your system with such an interface will work correctly ? Or does each one have to be implemented into your system - how much does this cost and how long does it take ?

kyry1 wrote:

Not to mention other equipment like multi-room systems, video conferencing, CCTV (this is standard).

Multiroom: http://www.nexwell.eu/produkt/nxw494-karta-multiroom, CCTV -
http://www.nexwell.eu/produkt/nxw304-karta-cctv video conferencing - especially often needed in private homes.
As for CCTV, in Nexo it is just a preview, any reaction of the system to a situation without video recording.

kyry1 wrote:

As far as the roller shutter control is concerned, I have not read whether the executive modules (relays) are programmable. I.e. is it possible to lower or raise a roller shutter from a wall button without a central unit ? (I mean the time delays between switching up/down so as not to damage the roller shutter motor)

Don't be ridiculous, mate - how can you imagine not using the basic functions for the safe operation of roller shutters in such a system ? Nexo - you can still control the roller shutters if the control panel main board is damaged.

kyry1 wrote:

All this is possible with CUE (kju). Not to mention that the system is equipped with analogue, digital, GPIO, voltage/current input/output ports, the use of which can be unlimited.
The price is also no longer as prohibitive as it was a dozen years ago.
Greetings

Modules, inputs, outputs, communication in Nexo, the possibilities almost endless:
http://www.nexwell.eu/system-nexo-0

kyry1 wrote:

Dear colleagues apropos the question of what has CUE that the above systems do not have:
Let's assume that a customer has devices controlled from an IR remote such as a TV, stereo etc. There may be a number of these remote controls. In cue it is possible to implement all these devices into one system and so have all the functions of all the remotes in one touch panel.
2 thing, I didn't go into depth, maybe I'm wrong but I didn't see in the above systems the possibility to control devices via RS232/422 or 485. Most projectors have such ports. Not to mention other devices like multi-room systems, video conferencing, CCTV (that's standard).
As far as roller shutter control is concerned, I have not read whether the executive modules (relays) are programmable. I.e. is it possible to lower or raise a roller shutter from a wall button without the central unit? (I mean the time delays between switching up/down so as not to damage the roller shutter motor)
All this is possible with the CUE (kju). Not to mention that the system is equipped with analogue ports, digital ports, GPIO, voltage/current inputs/outputs, the use of which can be unlimited.
The price is also no longer as prohibitive as it was a dozen years ago.
Regards

Mate do you write a lot of things that also hold ours?
I asked you to write us how your system differs from my Vimar By Me.

I understand that you have already fitted several such systems to customers and they are very satisfied. But it is worth reading what is going on behind your system and you need to educate yourself all the time. The field is very broad and has many applications, and we start with the customer what he really needs

Gentlemen, I am not saying that your systems are inferior; they will probably meet the expectations of most customers.
Please tell me whether your systems can be used to achieve, say, such automation:
- i come home and want to watch a film in my home cinema.
I want to do this with a single gesture. Whether it's pressing a button on a touch panel (wired, wireless or on a phone it doesn't matter, let's say there are three such panels with the same button).
When the button is pressed, a sequence of events known as a macro will trigger:
- the projector will switch on (in case the number of lamp hours is close to being finished a corresponding message will appear and an e-mail will be sent)
Other actions will be activated if the projector is turned on.
- the lighting will adjust
- the roller blinds will close
- the screen will open
- an amplifier is switched on (let's say a client has a fondness for a Dior 700 amplifier) and the volume is set
- the appropriate inputs are selected on the equipment (amplifier-tuner, projector-hdmi, appropriate input and output on the AV matrix)
- the bluray or other media player will be switched on
- the panel will display feedback about the status of the projector (on, off, cool down, start-up, number of lamp hours, filter, etc.)
During the projection, of course, we can adjust the volume, switch sources (bluray, laptop, videoconference), and control each device from any of the panels or a selected one. Check the weather, set the temperature or check that the flowers are watered.
This is something I could not find in your systems. But maybe such functionality is not necessary for the customer. As my colleague wisely wrote, it all depends on your needs.
Best regards

These are the kind of gestures you are talking about:
http://www.nexwell.eu/aktualnosci/nowosc-obsluga-gestow-uzytkownika-na-panelu-dotykowym-lcd
As you can see, since it is a virtual event, you can freely define what this gesture will do from switching on one "lamp" to starting/switching on/off/closing etc. etc. all possible resources of the system - for me it is an impractical gadget, although one of the users himself added such functionality to the system - in your company customers can also freely program, create logics in the system ?
And one more thing - this is not "my" system - I install it or prepare projects.

p.s - they write Novelty - and this "novelty" is at least for 3,4 years

kyry1 wrote:

- I walk into my house and want to watch a film on my home cinema.
I want to do this with a single gesture. Whether it's pressing a button on a touch panel (wired, wireless or on a phone it doesn't matter, let's say there are three such panels with the same button).
When the button is pressed, a sequence of events known as a macro will trigger:
- the projector will switch on (in case the number of lamp hours is close to being finished a corresponding message will appear and an e-mail will be sent)
Other actions will be activated if the projector is switched on.
- the lighting will adjust
- the roller blinds will close
- the screen will open
- an amplifier is switched on (let's say a client has a fondness for a Dior 700 amplifier) and the volume is set
- the appropriate inputs are selected on the equipment (amplifier-tuner, projector-hdmi, appropriate input and output on the AV matrix)
- the bluray or other media player will be switched on
- the panel will display feedback about the status of the projector (on, off, cool down, start-up, number of lamp hours, filter, etc.)
During the projection, of course, we can adjust the volume, switch sources (bluray, laptop, videoconference), and control each device from any of the panels or a selected one. Check the weather, set the temperature or check that the flowers are watered.

Sounds like a description of almost any solution because that's what IB.... is all about.
And any oagrarian engineer will put up such a system. A Raspberry alone with an OpenHub set up and matched with Integra would already do the job, not to mention integrations using PLC (Saia, Siemens, Wago, Fatek etc.) or KNX itself (Domovea from Hager, Home Server from Gira or Divus panels etc. etc.). Ba, even on fibaro it could be done.

Your colleague wants to prove the superiority of one system over another by force, which is completely missing the point. The truth is that the functionality of the system depends 90% on the ingenuity and knowledge of the designer/programmer and not on the system itself. And a clever designer is able to find the cheapest solution for the given functionality and requirements.

Colleague kasprzyk
there can be such a gesture as well. I didn't mean specifically whether the system has gesture support as in the link http://www.nexwell.eu/aktualno...ownika-na-panelu-dotykowym-lcd.
I was referring to what happens afterwards. Switching the electrics sequentially is I know not a problem. It's basic logic that can be done on gates. My point was whether:
- is it possible to have 2-way communication with devices such as a projector, TV
- is it possible to collect codes from any IR remote control and implement them in the software?
- it is possible to automatically send e-mails with data read from the user's devices (such as the number of hours of the projector lamp)
etc.

Buddy dzik84
I do not want to prove anything. I just wanted to know if it is possible in a Nexwell or Astat system:
- make a controller for any device operating on RS232/485
- possibility of making and stopping macros
- synchronisation of several panel-controllers (e.g. a tablet on android, a pc with windows and a panel on the wall)
- iR code ripping (e.g. from remote controls in order to launch e.g. a bluray somewhere in another room from a wall panel in the kitchen)

There was a question about what CUE can do that Nexwell or Astat cannot. Reading the specifications of these systems, I did not find such functionality.

It is obvious that CUE functionality can be realised with other toys (like, AMX, Crestron, rapsberyPi + something..., PVS from Katowice, or at least Amiga500 + something) but that was not what the discussion was about.

I think I was misunderstood. That was not my intention.
Greetings and good luck with your installations.

kyry1 wrote:

- make a driver for any device operating over RS232/485
- possibility to perform and stop macros
- synchronisation of several panel-controllers (e.g. a tablet on android, a pc with windows and a panel on the wall)
- ripping of IR codes (e.g. from remote controls in order to fire e.g. from a wall panel in the kitchen a bluray somewhere in another room)

ad.1 Nexwell multiroom card (NXW494) talks on 232 and the command card (NXW396) on 485
ad.2 Performing and stopping macros, that seems to be what most systems rely on
ad.3 I have not heard of a system that does not allow you to do the same thing from 2 or more panels/applications/controllers
ad.4 NXW296 - IR module


I would like to add that I am not installing Nexwell myself although the system looks nice and it took me 2 minutes to get this information on their website

kyry1 wrote:

Kolego kasprzyk
there can be such a gesture as well. I didn't mean specifically whether the system has gesture support as in the link http://www.nexwell.eu/aktualno...ownika-na-panelu-dotykowym-lcd.
I was referring to what happens afterwards. Switching the electrics sequentially is I know not a problem. It's basic logic that can be done on gates. My point was whether:
- is it possible to have 2-way communication with devices such as a projector, TV
- is it possible to collect codes from any IR remote control and implement them in the software?
- it is possible to automatically send e-mails with data read from the user's devices (such as the number of hours of the projector lamp)
etc.

Mate, here I wasn't just talking about physical resources, you can do other things already mentioned by a colleague above - read what exactly the idea of this system is.
You did not answer how the subject of programming the system looks like and how much does it cost to implement such a device, answer frankly, how many individual customers interested in the functionality described by you and in particular in the number of working hours of the projector?
What you are describing you must be implementing in conference rooms and other such facilities - believe me, the interest of individual customers in this matter in their own homes is very small - you may agree or disagree with it.

kind regards

Especially as the CUE system itself is dedicated to conference rooms, cinema halls or private cinemas. And yes, it can be packed into the home, but as a sub-system of a home cinema or multi-room, and not that the whole house is based on it, because then it is forcing the customer into a solution that is not dedicated to the task.

You stubbornly stand by arguments such as Audi is weak because you can load 15 tonnes of gravel into a Scania, but not into an Audi.
The same situation is here, CUE has its uses where I assume it is sensationally equipped to talk to a million types of AV equipment and it can be done easily on it (which doesn't mean it can't be done on other systems).
The same is true for HVAC automation, multi-level reaction to wall buttons (click, double click, hold for 2s, 5s, etc.), Ethernet cooperation with the alarm system (for information about motion sensors in order to control e.g. lighting) and other untypical solutions (there is a guy on the elka forum who uses Fibaro to show which route to take to work or to take the kids to school in the morning, based on data about traffic jams from google maps). It can be done on CUE, maybe yes, maybe no, but it is certainly easier/better to do it on another system.

In a word of summary. There is no perfect system, everything has its place and use, such as those projector hours, probably an easy thing to do in CUE, can also be done on others. But, as the colleague above mentioned, at home, why should anyone need it, the projector will show that it is time for service anyway. But in a hotel, "Mr Zenek" will be very happy to receive a text message that the bulb in the projector in room C needs to be changed. Similarly, multi-channel PID control in HVAC or other "analogue" calculations and more logically complex systems based on CUE are either impossible or a breakneck task. On a PLC or other dedicated system - a normal job.

After the stubbornness of a colleague and his place of residence, I dare say he has connections with AVprojekt from Wrocław, which installs this CUE. And as the company itself says/advertises on the web, it is a system mainly for cinemas, conference rooms, etc., and the fact that other things can be done at the same time. Obviously, nobody in their right mind is going to set up an additional system to control the lighting and roller blinds in three conference rooms, when they already have a multimedia control system capable of doing this. In the same way, in an office building or conference centre, CUE does multimedia and that's it, because the lighting, roller blinds, HVAC and a million other things are the responsibility of the BMS based on KNX or whatever.



Now back to the main thread and the author's question.
First of all, find out what kind of installers you have in your area and what they work on.

In my opinion, if you do not want to have any fancy features, you can do it economically, e.g. by integrating Satel Integra with Fibaro or Loxone. Or even taking Integra itself with a TSI panel, at most adding a small cheap PLC (e.g. Fatek or even Siemens LOGO) to it

Bms on knx a failure might as well recommend lonworks.

This is what I am reading,
I have been reading, the house is made on a simple PLC, for me such a house means control of a chiropractor, heater, furnace and so on, starting from bathroom fans to pressure transducers, differential pressure sensors, co2 sensors and so on.
I have set up everything on a carel pco5 plus a pcoe with a web card, all via a router.
Starting with a room with a fireplace, where smoke never escapes because I have a differential pressure transmitter, where at 3 Pa nothing can escape, the fans work with inverters, and the trinkets with counting time of operation, control sockets are side toys for 2000 and a few hours of programming you can have everything.

PLC is dozens if not hundreds of hours of sculpting.

If you're looking for something in the price and capabilities of a PLC, but tailored to ID and fabulously simple to configure then Loxone is the only one. In this price/capability range there is no alternative.

sculptures you just need to know what you are doing and I know what I expect in my home.
Show me how when you come home from work you establish:
you keep 600ppm of carbon dioxide in the house, it's 21 degrees with 55% humidity. how do you save energy on the pumps with inverters? you save on the furnace by keeping the mix on the back and using www to raise the temperature.
you have to realise that an inteigrated house is one in which I feel good because I have a comfortable and perfect environment. It's not about turning on the lights in the stairwell, it's about air and temperature
i would be happy to see a demonstration of how you can maintain these conditions in a room and then I can show you how a good recuperator with a good programme works.

Added after 1 [minute]:

Rather there are no better controllers for ventilation and air conditioning like carel

Added after 2 [minutes]:

on zycznie write good program na carela

Download the configuration soft and play around in simulation mode:
http://www.loxone.com/tl_files/loxone/downloads/config/Loxone-Config-7.1.12.31.zip

What you have written is easily doable, plus a lot more. Does your heating count the heat demand for each zone and factor this into the temperature at the mixer? Can it predict the time needed for heating with an accuracy of +/-10 min?

Take an interest - a lot of friends in the industry were very surprised when they got into the subject. And when they saw the price they went crazy. A server with 8 binary inputs 24V + 8 outputs 230V 5A + 4 outputs 0-10V + 4 inputs 0-10V + KNX port costs about 2000 zl.