Location of the twisted pair in the ground in the pipe or without?

I am going to install the cameras and I will have to pull the CAT 5e twisted pair in the ground on two 3.5 and 10 meter sections. I have such a cable adapted to external conditions, but I wonder if I should bury it in the ground, e.g. in a corrugated pipe, because the cameras will be installed in a different place after some time and it will be easier to pull out the cable, but I heard that supposedly water gets into such pipes which is hard to remove and the cables are in the water, and through this cable goes both data transmission and power. What do you advise to lay the cable loosely in the ground or in some sheath and what exactly?

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If you want to take them out "after some time", it's rather in a cover - in my opinion the cheapest conduit.
How will they be in the water then what? If it's not Chinese, this cable will outlive 2 generations of cameras, maybe then there will be satellite cameras?

You can cover it, but you don't have to. For peace of mind, put it in the conduit, but with a slope in one direction, so that the water runs off, or possibly cut the conduit gently to drain it.

Better something more solid than an ordinary conduit so that a potential pest at least notices the obstacle ..

mariusz77_ wrote:

I have such a cable adapted to external conditions

And that is what it is all about, whether it is an external cable or an earth cable. If a real earth (i.e. not only gelled, but also with sufficiently thick insulation ensuring mechanical resistance), it does not really matter whether it will be laid directly in the ground or in some cover. it's just a lottery.

@ mariusz77_ Looking at the distances you indicated in the topic, assuming that you are using a good quality earth twisted pair (as he wrote @suworow ) I would ignore the conduit or the pipe, because does it make sense to recover 13.5m of cable when moving the camera, then it is not better to put a new one? The cost will be small. In fact, an additional cable cover can cause more problems, as bleeds and cuts can help, but if the substrate is absorbed properly (if it rains all day, it will be 100% swamp in a conduit or pipe, before the water evaporates from the ground, it will pass the next ones). a few days A good earth wire (in gel with a thick, black cover) should be enough, of course I assume that heavy equipment will not drive around the place where the wire is buried.

suworow wrote:

mariusz77_ wrote:

I have such a cable adapted to external conditions

And that is what it is all about, whether it is an external cable or an earth cable. If a real earth (and therefore not only gelled, but also with sufficiently thick insulation ensuring its mechanical resistance, it does not really matter whether it will be laid directly in the ground or in some kind of cover. it's just a lottery.

I thought that such cables can only be divided into internal and external ones, but I can see that they are also grounded. I do not know if the cable I have is external or earth. It is similar in thickness to the internal one, maybe it is a little less flexible and it has a black sheath, so luminous, but does it have any other characteristic features that can be used to tell what type of cable it is?

I consider placing the cable in a cover mainly because I would like to minimize the possibility of a possible short circuit. I am not worried about mechanical damage (probably rodents do not like such things?) Because the cable will be laid directly in the ground or in some cover at a depth of the spade's length and does not provide for digging or other activities at this depth at this point . It will only be driven by an aerator and scarifier, but they do not cut or puncture the soil that deep.

fuutro wrote:

Better something more solid than an ordinary conduit so that a potential pest at least notices the obstacle ..

It is true that someone can always forget himself, so if I put him directly in the ground, it is better to mark somehow that there is something in this place. Do you have any ideas?

What else do you mean besides the conduit?

Hello,

Instead of a conduit, you can use a PVC pipe for water, such a blue one, I don't know what its professional name is, but it's perfect.

Greetings.

mariusz77_ wrote:

It is similar in thickness to the internal one, maybe it is a little less flexible and it has a black sheath, so luminous, but does it have any other characteristic features that can be used to tell what type of cable it is?

Markings ?, but the description does not suggest that it is a cable that can be laid in the ground with a clear conscience. Maybe a photo?

mariusz77_ wrote:

I thought that such cables can only be divided into internal and external ones, but I can see that they are also underground

Because the suppliers themselves probably do not clearly define it, or they use both terms interchangeably. Example:
https://www.speckable.pl/kategoria/272/kable-...ody-teleinformatyczne-dozenne-(zelowane).html
Outside, it just needs to withstand the appropriate temperature range, not get wet in rain, and be UV resistant.
The auction portals are full of cables for PLN / meter, where sellers even say that it is a natural cable. I prefer to avoid this type of occasion, I prefer to add a bit and have something more decent.

mariusz77_ wrote:

the cable will be laid directly in the ground or in some cover at a depth of the spade's length and does not provide for digging or other activities at that depth.

mariusz77_ wrote:

It is true that someone can always forget himself, so if I put him directly in the ground, it is better to mark somehow that there is something in this place. Do you have any ideas?

Put a protective foil at the depth of the top and the cable itself a dozen or so centimeters lower

Even a specially sealed conduit will not protect against water ingress, and if the water gets in, it will stay there and the cable will lie in the water and it will be much worse than if the cable itself was lying in the ground without protection. Also, if no one is going to dig in this place or will not be driving any heavy equipment, in my opinion it is better to install without a conduit or any pipes.

Give this plastic pipe like a colleague writes above. It will protect the cable from the blow with a shovel and maybe even a pickaxe.

Use a HDPE conduit. They are with a remote control that facilitates the pulling of the cord.

fuutro wrote:

Give me that plastic pipe

fuutro wrote:

It will protect the cable from the blow with a shovel and maybe even a pickaxe.

Of course.

dktr wrote:

Use a HDPE conduit. They are with a remote control for easy cable pulling.

The conduit is too thin. Besides, the conduit is not buried in the ground / soil.
And the pilot has nothing to do with it.

The essential feature of the steam cable used in the construction here - the tightness of the cable sheath must be guaranteed - against the ingress of moisture into the cable core.

Such tightness is ensured by the so-called GLOVERA barriers. Such technology
she had f-ma RAYCHEM ... I looked at these cables that are currently available and I can not see ... You need to find a domestic telecommunications producer - who else
maybe it produces gelled cables with a Glover barrier.
There may also be cables lying around after dismantling the suspended lines.

Cables without this barrier are useless. Below is a description of the barrier / in the text of the message of the manufacturer I found - BITNER:

"Damp proof barrier: aluminum tape covered on both sides with a layer of ethylene co-polymer" - / GLOVERA barrier /

Telecommunication cables are not cables for outdoor installations - they are to be installed in rooms inside buildings.

I recommend something like this - it is inexpensive, and produced by a Polish manufacturer. According to the catalog card, it can be given directly to the ground:

http://bitner.com.pl/produkty/szczegoly/130,katalog-bitlan-uutpf-cat5e-outdoor-200-mhz

dktr wrote:

Use a HDPE conduit. They are with a remote control that facilitates the pulling of the cord.

This is a valuable clue.
Give as above and you have peace.
If you want without a cover, remember to prepare the substrate for the cable + foil.

From what I have read, the description on the cable is as follows:
GetFort GF-5UTP-UU U / UTP 4x2x24AWG (0.5) cat.5e outdoor 200 MHz PN-EN 50173-1: 2011 ISO / IEC 11801 AHSI / TIA

The person who sold the cable said it could even lie in the water.

Below is a photo of this cable:


Can anyone provide links to stationary and online stores where he bought a cable that is actually adapted to be laid in the ground?

suworow wrote:

Put a protective foil at the depth of the top and the cable itself a dozen or so centimeters lower

Fotodetektor wrote:

If you want without a cover, remember to prepare the substrate for the cable + foil.

So when I put the cable directly in the ground, first I put the cable, and then I cover it with foil or some material (agrotextile can be?)

Hello,

Do not take a picture of the entire disc of the cable, because it will not help. Take a clear picture of the marking on the cable.

Greetings.

You put the cable on the sand (if there is nothing similar, so that it does not lie on stones, for example), cover it and give the foil, for example, for a good etch over the cable and then bury it ready.

The cover will come out more expensive as a cable, and the cable is to be temporarily. So we have a variant of "lost conduit" - for consideration

Chris_W wrote:

The cover will come out more expensive as a cable, and the cable is to be temporarily. So we have a variant of "lost conduit" - for consideration

The most important thing is that, regardless of whether the cable is placed in a conduit or a tube or directly in the ground, there is no conclusion as a result of which the cameras and recorder will break, because here the losses will be incomparably greater.

There will probably be 12V, you can shorten the power supply and if something is to burn because of this, it must (and there are also fuses), the camera may be damaged, but this is a very unlikely case, you need really specific conditions to kill the camera in this way - the conditions would have to be on the verge of diversion and sabotage - that is, someone is playing with the cables ...
In general, the fact that there will be power and signal there is of no importance to the malfunction of the (potential) camera, cable or recorder.

As our colleague from Siedlce writes, the chance of damaging the equipment is small.
The chance of damaging the cable itself is also not very high. Practice (not mine ) shows that even the most lousy conduit, laid without ballast, directly in the ground with stones, etc., usually leads a long and peaceful life. We, the installers (some), sometimes make excessive hype about it. We just want to do everything so that in the event of a failure we can look the customer in the eye and say that it was not our fault. Hence the casing pipes, appropriate cables and protective films. Paprak will simply blame the client "for something you were digging here, you forgot that there are cables in this place" or: "ladies, there are no strong points on the water"
I was in a breakdown today. Electricians, while digging for their cables, cut camera cables reaching up to 10 cm under the turf (that they were not taken with rakes by the lawn)
The administrator of the estate stated that it was the absolute fault of the electricians because they did not exercise due care, and before starting the work, they did not read the documentation that she showed them. Sure, these cables were probably marked there, and probably with the information that they were bare just under the turf. In order not to damage them, they should probably use methods used in archeology
ps. and do not believe electricians when they tell you that they connected the twisted pair

I know that I am playing archeologist, but maybe it will be useful to someone.
I have been working with cables for over 40 years.
Theoretically - low voltage and teletechnical cables are laid at least 70 cm underground, 10 cm of sand without stones above and below the cable, in the middle of the trench depth warning tape (orange for teletechnics).
In practice - hardly anyone does it exactly ...
"outdoor" means that the cable is resistant to UV rays, which means that it will not fall apart after a few years from sunlight. In practice, in this case, the coating is usually made of black PE and the medium is filled with a hydrophobic gel (only so that it is longitudinally sealed, i.e. so that kilometers of the medium do not get wet after damage to the coating).
Cables with a sheath of light (white) PE, gray PP, white PVC - are not UV resistant.
Black PVC sheathed cables are UV resistant, but may crack when bent in frost.
Teletechnical cables (insulation and PE coating) also have a Glover anti-moisture barrier made of Al foil, which is also a screen.
They can also have mechanical reinforcement against damage (steel tape, aramid fibers, etc.).
Power and signal cables (PVC insulation and sheath) do not have this barrier. They are also not longitudinally tight - it does not matter as much as in teletechnics.
Such cables with a grounded structure may have an additional layer of insulation. But they don't have to.
Laying the cable in the ground in a corrugated pipe (conduit) does not make much sense:
- does not provide mechanical protection, including against rodents (and even attracts them)
- does not provide protection against water
- the tube is not UV resistant (maybe some are black)
- cable replacement in such a tube is usually doomed to failure
A water pipe or PEX have similar disadvantages.
If we want to have mechanical protection, UV resistance and the possibility of quick cable replacement - only the black RHDPE32 tube (or 40). Finally, a PVC installation tube (corrugated connectors are not UV resistant!). An additional advantage is that a random sharp pebble will not "bite" the thin telephone cable.
The cable is in no way disturbed by lying in the water. Unless it is an ordinary, white teletechnical installation cable inside - with time the veins will turn black, although no dramatic deterioration of parameters is visible. There is always water in the pipeline. So there are no dips and cuts to drain the water. The sense is to seal the penetrations through walls and pipeline ends in a building. And it is not PUR foam, but the means intended for it. And above all, not against water but against gases.

There is something like an arot or dvr pipe - it is a conduit prepared for laying in the ground, hard, thick and flexible, water does not collect in it because it has holes for draining it

Arot is the company's name, DVK is a flexible pipe of this company, sold in 6 m sections, quite stiff, DVR is its flexible type, sold in 25 and 50 m discs. Additionally, a system of couplings, gaskets and elbows.
There are no holes, on the contrary - mudproof (without gaskets) and watertight (with gaskets) couplings. And these are not provisional connections at all.
Red or blue colors not resistant to UV, black ones resistant to UV, others on request, different diameters (50, 75, 100, 160, 232 mm).
Similar are also produced not by Arot, but somehow it is common to call all flexible cable pipes arotami.
The mechanical resistance is not too great, it is more about the ease of shaping and the possibility of rebuilding the cables without excavation than about mechanical protection.
Well, these are cables that are much thicker than the title twisted pair.
Somehow it is also assumed that all conduit pipes are called conduit, from real conduits (single-wall, small-diameter corrugated pipe), through RHDPE, to double-walled "Arots".