Connection of household appliances in the kitchen (oven, microwave, fridge)

Hello, we bought a new apartment and we are finally starting to do it, but there is a problem with the electrics for household appliances, namely the refrigerator, oven and microwave ... The problem is because the places where these appliances will be changed compared to what the developer came up with . The carpenter wanted to connect it all to the cables from an ordinary light switch, even when I was unfamiliar with electricity, I came to the conclusion that this was something wrong ...

In the kitchen I have "strength" and it will go under induction, I also have fuses and thus separate sockets for a dishwasher and refrigerator (and there is also a separate fuse called "kitchen", I think this one is for such junk as cooker hood, kettle, etc. ), so I hope that there are 2.5 mm2 cables and 16A fuses ... At the beginning I had the idea to put a 2.5 mm2 cable behind the furniture from the socket originally intended for the refrigerator, but whether the refrigerator, oven and microwave will not be too much?

Maybe the cable from the dishwasher's socket should be pulled under the microwave / refrigerator?

I'd rather not move my strength ...

ps. I don't know much about electricity so sorry if I write anything stupid.

ps.2 Forging walls is no longer an option, so I have to figure it out somehow ... the induction hob has "strength" and we leave it, but it also made a problem, because from what I read people connect 2 phases for induction, and 1 for the oven ... and because the oven goes to a different place, I have to connect the oven, fridge, microwave and dishwasher to two circuits, so from what I can see you will have to "pair" it somehow.

I think, shouldn't I configure it so that the oven with the fridge and the microwave with the dishwasher? I use the logic of counting the watts ... oven 2000-3000, fridge 600-800, microwave and dishwasher is max 3000 for both ...

Maybe in diffrent way? Oven with a microwave and not to use both?

A separate circuit with protection for each device over 2kW.

It's hard to straighten out such a mess. What happens when we turn on 2 devices at the same time? From the perspective of cable protection, we could assume 5kW as the maximum power, but a new facility and such a carving? It sounds absurd.

The mess is a bit caused by a carpenter who made a suggestion like this and that I accepted it, and then when I read it, I started my head ... But something like I wrote? Now I am inclined to say that the oven and microwave oven for 1 circuit (2000-3000 W oven, and 1000W microwave oven) and the second circuit is dishwasher and fridge (1400 + 800) ??????

Personally, I would make a separate circuit for the oven, while the microwave, refrigerator and dishwasher on the other circuit.

As a rule, two circuits are made in the kitchen, one for the oven (kitchen), sometimes even 3f, and the second circuit for sockets on the walls. Everything in the kitchen is connected to these sockets and has a plug on the cable. However, the oven does not have a plug and the instructions contain information that it is to be connected by a qualified electrician under the pain of the warranty being void. This is why someone with knowledge checks if you have enough power for the oven.

The rest of the devices go to standard sockets.

3.1.11. It is forbidden to publish entries that do not contain substantive content, contain harmful advice, advice that is not an attempt to solve the problem, and the publication of identical entries consecutive or repeating information from the discussion.


There is no such rule. However, there is a rule that the more circuits, the more functional the installation.
Savings often turn into bungling unnoticed.

I withdraw the "help" of the post. [Kkas12]

You could afford a carpenter, now don't feel sorry for an electrician and that's it.

Just what an electrician will come up with without breaking the walls .. and I am writing that it is impossible anymore.

In total, we will do it as a KMY colleague wrote, an oven for one circuit, a dishwasher, a fridge and a microwave for the second one, and the hood and everything that will stand on the countertops (kettle, coffee machine and whatever you can get there) will go to the third one, and of course strength for induction.

a KMY mate should learn a little first instead of writing silly tips. Dishwasher, fridge and microwave ... together something for 6kW.

Characteristics B, protection 16A rated current. Overload 1.13 to 1.45 of the rated protection current.
1.13 x 16A = 18.08A -> 18A x 230V = 4150W = 4.15kW
1.45 x 16A = 23.2A -> 23A x 230V = 5336W = 5.3kW

The overload protection works between these powers. Of course, the time of such work is also important, but while you can wait for hours at the lower limit, it will be "fast" in the upper limit.

Is there a residual current device somewhere in the installation?

I read that, however, the microwave is up to 1000W (that's what I'm going to buy), the fridge is 800W (with a freezer it's probably more? But not colossal) and the dishwasher is up to 1500W, so everything is up to 4kW ....

As for the differential (I hope that's what you mean), I have two ...

What should I connect the oven to? Pulling one phase to the other end of the kitchen? I do not believe that people always have an oven where there is induction and they have to cope somehow.

Barsa8 wrote:

ps. I don't know much about electricity so sorry if I write anything stupid.

Therefore, a specialist consultation on site is necessary.

Maybe I will call an electrician, but I prefer to have some knowledge on this subject ... because I have already dealt with various professionals and it was not always nice, despite the fact that the "paper" was ...

Secondly, if the electrician will not be able to hammer the walls, I should call him to connect the oven?

The electrics are looked for in front of the furniture, not when the building is twisted and the walls are painted. 2 circuits per kitchen is not a bug. This is a crime story. I am very curious what the project contains. Probably the RCD protecting the kitchen and bathroom circuits together, and the other to the rooms. Tragicomedy.

What is the wire cross section of a three-phase circuit?

You have a vague idea of what an electrician is for - I assure you this profession entitles you not only to hammer in the wall.

pol102 wrote:

Dishwasher, fridge and microwave ... together something for 6kW.

If these 3 devices had 6kW, they could not be connected in virtually any kitchen.
Find and give one example of these three devices (manufacturer, type) with a total power of 6kW, we will discuss.

3.1.11. It is forbidden to publish entries that do not contain substantive content, contain harmful advice, advice that is not an attempt to solve the problem, and the publication of identical entries consecutive or repeating information from the discussion.

I traditionally withdraw "Pomoga". [Kkas12]

pol102 wrote:

The electrics are looked for in front of the furniture, not when the building is twisted and the walls are painted. 2 circuits per kitchen is not a bug. This is a crime story. I am very curious what the project contains. Probably the RCD protecting the kitchen and bathroom circuits together, and the other to the rooms. Tragicomedy.

What is the wire cross section of a three-phase circuit?

Hey .... there is 1-circuit for the dishwasher, 2-for the fridge and 3- "general" for the kitchen (sockets on the work belt and the hood) + strength, so how well do I count it 4?

The cross-section of these three is 2.5 m2, and the force is probably 4 mm2

ps. the buildings are not twisted, but the walls are already made ... as I wrote, I fell because I trusted the carpenter, and because I have many things on my mind, despite my fears, I did not check the matter right away. Another thing is that I am now working with the finishing team from the developer, I have a nice price per meter, but for additional items they sing such amounts that it was a shock, so I limited these additional topics with them ...

ps. 2 I appreciate the profession of an electrician, but I simply can't "conjure up" anything without hitting the wall ...

Therefore, call an electrician with a wall chaser with a vacuum cleaner and pay for moving the sockets. Little mess, lost somewhere between PLN 100-150 for an electrician and PLN 30 for polishing. Instead, there will be a safe electrical installation, operating in accordance with the designer's intention.

Added after 5 [minutes]:

KMY wrote:

pol102 wrote:

Dishwasher, fridge and microwave ... together something for 6kW.

If these 3 devices had 6kW, they could not be connected in virtually any kitchen.
Find and give one example of these three devices (manufacturer, type) with a total power of 6kW, we will discuss.

Am I supposed to educate myself for you? A random Bosch dishwasher, 60cm. It's like that, for example, because I'm not going to prove anything to you.

Quote:

Technical data
Connected load (W) 2400 W
Current (A) 10 A.
Voltage (V) 220-240V

The dishwasher is supposed to have a separate protection, and do not argue with it at all.

Okay, he will move my sockets, but what will I gain from this? I prefer to let go of the cables behind the furniture than to interfere with the wall ... I will not conjure up another circuit for me, I will still have to connect the microwave, oven, dishwasher and refrigerator to 2 circuits!

Not to mention the fact that the sockets are to be on the mdf wall, which is just going to be built, and in the meantime, tiles will be placed on the wall, and here there will be a chapel, a cable only under the strip ...

If the only solution is to buy devices with low power consumption or use them wisely (not turning everything on at once), then we will do it, we got ourselves into this mess :|

edit- If I count correctly, we probably have 12 kW of conversion power, in a large plate they have 5-6kW without strength and they can do it, they have household appliances ... are we not exaggerating?

Barsa8 wrote:

edit- If I count correctly, we probably have 12 kW of conversion power, in a large plate they have 5-6kW without strength and they can do it, they have household appliances ... are we not exaggerating?

No. Building law and voluntary standards from which to learn make it clear how to install installations in buildings / rooms.

If you can, please include a situational sketch. Plan view of the kitchen with appliances and sockets marked.

The author of the topic already has a solution, and he wrote on the forum to confirm the solution he invented, so further advice is pointless.

Masking strip ... and under it a 2.5 mm2 cable

Tell me what I have spartolone? A dishwasher has a circuit, a fridge, an oven and induction have, and it is general for a kitchen ... They really envy so many fuses and strength in the big hob, I now have an electric oven, refrigerator, microwave, coffee machine and other small appliances under one in my apartment. perimeter. The apartment must have a washing machine circuit, a garden and a reserve ... maybe I don't remember something yet. Today I will throw in a photo of the distribution box, will something help you?


Now I am throwing the oven somewhere else, as probably a lot of people now, to have better access to it, and the refrigerator ... and this is a problem, because in this configuration I will not connect the oven by force, so I have to connect it somewhere. I have two circuits to choose from, because it's better not to touch the general one ... It has to be solved somehow, without forging, and it seems to me that it is possible.

I know that the electrics had to be done earlier to make everything cool and cool, but well, gentlemen, the experts came in earlier with painting and tiles, and I was a few days late to start the topic here ... such a life, you have to deal with this conundrum.

Do not take this post as an attack on my part, because I understood a lot thanks to your posts, but hey, you won't always be able to do everything 100%, sometimes you have to be content with 95% and live somehow

There are too many complexities here. Make a drawing of the kitchen, even in paint, with marked sockets and devices. For this, a photo of the home switchboard. This will give you an insight into the idea.

pol102 wrote:

2 circuits per kitchen is not a bug. This is a crime story. I am very curious what the project contains. Probably the RCD protecting the kitchen and bathroom circuits together, and the other to the rooms. Tragicomedy.

The installation was made / designed well. The three-phase circuit was probably intended for an electric stove and oven. Two single-phase dedicated circuits and one for general purpose kitchen sockets is a good standard for an apartment. Read the author's first post carefully and don't write about tragicomedy.
Even the best-made installation can be "spoiled" by not sticking to the design from A to Z. Of course, a lot can be changed, but at the right stage. Often the culprit is a carpenter who "advises" the investor how the furniture in the kitchen should look like. He does it in good faith, but for himself to make it easier for him to do and the investor, being a layman, often does not embrace the whole and then such flowers. Life.

I used to do some things in Ikea and there was something left, I hope you can see everything ... I did not mention how I want to pull the cables, because it is to be agreed.

Maybe you give a refrigerator under the general "kitchen", and microwaves with a dishwasher ... but it will be cables behind the furniture, that hey.

Jann111 is right ... with the fact that it was not Mr. Carpenter who wanted such a layout, and we, because few cabinets would be in the arrangement that the developer came up with ... oven and microwave :idea:

Today I will throw in a photo of the distribution box.

I was in the apartment and I was surprised myself, because there is no "refrigerator" circuit (I was surprised that there would be such a thing, because the refrigerator is below 1000W), my memory played a trick on me.

I throw in the improved visualization of the furniture, the photo of the distribution box and the photo of the box with cables for strength:



Well, with the case presented in this way, it seems that the developer combined this way: electric cooker + induction by force, dishwasher for 1 circuit, and the rest for 2 ... a new wall, and the refrigerator and microwave oven should be placed under the "kitchen" perimeter. Do not touch the dishwasher circuit and only connect the dishwasher ...

Take an electrician to work, because somehow I do not trust that this carpenter will connect the induction to me well and pull the cables under the oven ... It is a pity that all sockets for the "kitchen" circuit are high, but I will use a masking strip and that's it.

Do I combine well? I am waiting for hints. How about what the picture of the switch box shows.

-edit- I'm intrigued by the "reserve" fuse, but I don't think this one will be useful to me ...

As something needs to be done, and it's a bit late for doing the installation by needs, I would risk this option:
- furrow from the box with the circuit wire "electric cooker" to the place where the oven will be. A normal tin next to the oven and in the final 'phase' a socket with a protective contact. Cable min 2.5mm2.
- the dishwasher stays

Logical problem: if the microwave, refrigerator, absorber and sockets above the countertop are one circuit, what will happen to the refrigerator if you turn on the microwave, electric kettle and absorber? ...

This is the question for you. If you can answer this question, you will do the right thing.
There is a long way from the simultaneity factor assumed by the designer to the reality. It is not so bad if the design assumptions can be adapted to this reality, worse when it is no longer possible.

Furrow ... and you can't just let the cable go behind the furniture? 2.5 mm2 cable is enough, yes? Because I was thinking about 4 mm2.

As for the refrigerator and turning on the rest of the devices "at once", nothing will happen to the refrigerator and the fuse will "blow"?

I have a neighbor for me, to replace the protection from a three-pole to 3 single-pole ... and connect induction to 1 phase, but it's probably already "over-combining"?