Small Delivery Van for Food Products: Fiat Ducato vs Boxer vs Jumper vs Vivaro vs Crafter

Question

Hello, I would like to ask for your opinions on delivery trucks. Currently, I am looking for a small delivery van for the transport of food products such as bars, gum, coffee, etc. The budget I can allocate is about PLN 25,000. I want the car to be relatively young, because I also carry it with...

12pawel · Answer

And I propose Transit. The engine is best 2.4 140KM
For 25 thousand you will buy this around 2009. The engine will turn 500k km, the only problem is the EGR valve, every 150,000 needs to be replaced, the rest flashes as it should.

Kune · Answer

I can only say what we had. I do not know what size of car you need because you compare Vivaro with Carfter. Where two Vivars can be loaded into the Crafter :)

Ducato (2006-) is a very spacious and reliable car. Cheap parts, the 3.0 engine is a really proven unit (from Iveco) and it easily handles the highway at high speeds. You only have to watch out for the gearboxes and the clutch, because this engine gives her a bit of a hard time. The car is relatively comfortable, it does not play on the road, well soundproofed. The Boxer and Jumper twins have different engines, apparently the smallest ones are a moderately successful design, but someone who rode them must have an opinion.

We have two Vivaras, one 2008 and one 2014. Both 2.0 CDTI (or 2.0 DCI). Auto twin brother of Trafic and Primestar. A very comfortable car, you don't feel this size while driving. It is true that I was driving a passenger version (it serves as a goods one), it is a bit better muted and better made.
The car (2008) traveled over 380kkm and no problems. Replaced two injectors (quite an expensive matter, but I managed to buy a set of new injections occasionally), a starter, EGR and a clutch (the car sometimes drives with a tow truck). 115km engine, after a chip for 145 horses (new) and is still 180 km / h on the highway - it does not want to break down. We didn't do anything in the suspension for this time, only now there is play on the steering gear. Turbo original.
Very nice car, I recommend it, but only with 2.0 CDTI !!

Crafter / Sprinter is a very nice and comfortable car, but very expensive to operate. They also rust. With your budget, it's probably not the league. Only the earlier sprinter, which is also rusting to power, would enter the game, but in this budget Ducato will be better in every respect.

12pawel wrote:
And I propose Transit. The engine is best 2.4 140KM
For 25 thousand you will buy this around 2009. The engine will turn 500k km, the only problem is the EGR valve, every 150,000 needs to be replaced, the rest flashes as it should.

See how much the engine costs if necessary. I do not recommend Transit, we have a tow truck, Ducato much better, also in terms of driving. The Transit Plus is an optional rear drive.

adikojot1 · Answer

Thank you, gentlemen, for the information.

I will definitely consider Transit - although it will probably be necessary to check the possible costs of living - how they relate to each other.

How about the price / year ratio?
I know that you can buy junk and expensive, but I would like to know what I can count on more or less with this amount in relation to the year :)

Greetings,

Added after 4 [minutes]:

See how much the engine costs if necessary. I do not recommend Transit, we have a tow truck, Ducato much better, also in terms of driving. Plus Transit is an optional rear drive. [/ Quote]

So I understand that the Transit has a rear drive.?
And how does this car behave in winter - you have to be very careful?

12pawel · Answer

Transits are different, with front and rear drive depending on your needs. There are also different versions when it comes to the length and height of the pack. I drive with the longest kennel and the rear drive. The car weighs about 2300 kg and drives well even in winter. It is known that with the rear drive, the driver's caution is important because ESP will not do everything. The advantage of the rear-wheel drive, however, is the downforce of the rear axle with a load and it copes better on snow than the front-wheel-drive vans.

wojciechjanusz · Answer

From 2000 to 2011 there were 2.4l engines in Transit and they had a rear drive. The 2.0 (until 2006) and 2.2 (after 2006) engines are front-wheel drive. After 2011, all Transits have 2.2 engines. The rear drive is heavier models with a greater GVM, most often over 3.3 tons. If you want a van with a lower payload, I definitely recommend the front-wheel drive. The rear drive in winter conditions is a terrible story in such a van, the car only goes heavily loaded, empty is a real massacre - the car does not go forward, and the rear flies sideways. And this applies not only to the Transit, but also to other rear-wheel driveers such as the Crafter, Sprinter, etc. The front-drive Transit, on the other hand, always goes forward like a tank - whether ice or snow, a completely different ride. Generally, when you buy a Transit, you certainly get the most for the money you put in - there is no doubt. I have driven many vans - Transit drives by far the best of all vans (with a similar configuration) - driving pleasure and comfort are by far the greatest. The problem is that when you buy a car that drives for profit, which is several to several years old, you can get on a nice face. Rarely, someone sells such a car because they get bored - most often you have to put more money in it, for example, make injections or a pump. But this applies to all commercial cars ...

balonika3 · Answer

I already had the pleasure to reload the front-wheel drive (Jumper) onto the Kia. He stood half-loaded on a snowy, estate road and kiss him backwards. And the hill was not big at all and the tires were new ...

12pawel · Answer

I already had 2 transits, one to the front, now I have to the rear. As for pace I have goods, with the rear-wheel drive I will go really further on the snow than with the front-wheel drive, but the pressure on the axle does its job.

wojciechjanusz · Answer

Buddy ... You drive loaded, but you come back empty. The rear-wheel-drive, empty delivery van is a slippery - compared to the front-wheel drive - simply a tragedy. Such a van only makes sense when driving constantly with large loads. I traveled over 1.5 million km in rear-wheel drive vans - so don't convince me ... I couldn't even turn the rear-wheel drive Transit on grass with a heavy trailer with two horses. Well, I guess the loaded front-wheel drive has more axle pressure - am I wrong?

adikojot1 · Answer

Thanks to everyone for your interest in the topic.

As of today, the favorites are Ducato and I am thinking about Vivaro - sometimes I will have to put the whole pallet in the car and I do not know if Vivaro will fit ..

If you can, I would like to ask for your feedback on the Ducato engines.
I already know Vivaro, my friend threw an excellent argument for which I am grateful and I also reached a friend who is servicing Opel and confirmed what was said on the forum.

The question is still about Transit.

Something about these engines: (belt or chain, like injectors in this car, clutch, how with mileage, how much the engine can withstand in medium use - you know it will be a car not first-hand)

Ford Transit VI 2.2 Duratorq TDCi 140KM from 2009

Ford Transit VI 2.2 Duratorq TDCi 115KM from 2009

Ford Transit VI 2.2 TDCi 110KM from 2006

Kune · Answer

You really drove the new Crafter and Sprinter and you think the Transit is more convenient and more comfortable ?? !! You are the only one I know and says so. Also consider Masetera / Movano if you want a bigger car. I only had a fleeting affair with the 2.5CDTI (2009) and the other on twins (2.8? -2014 I think). Quite a solid and comfortable car, I just don't know what the costs of servicing and maintaining this car look like. Apparently many people fly this route and it's ok, but apart from the experience of using it, I won't help much. Transit, Movano, Master - all these cars are available with front or rear drive. This is important if we are transporting heavy things or pulling a tow truck. It's not like the RWD will fall straight into the ditch, but the rear drive has its own nuances. Avoid rare 4x4 versions (like Ducato or Sprinter). 316CDI 4x4 has terribly expensive parts for the front suspension (ASO only) is taller and consumes a terrible amount of fuel, but it will go wherever you need to - it's just a curiosity.

12pawel · Answer

Well, now you took me down normally. I read 3 times because I thought I saw something wrong. Well, unless you load the goods into the cabin instead of the packing.

adikojot1 · Answer

Gentlemen,

And can you tell me more about the models that we have discussed, such things as:

1.Clutch (all cars already have a dual mass flywheel)?
2. How much is such a clutch able to withstand?
3.How about cost of parts? (of course I compared prices from the most popular auction site, but I'd rather rely on your experience)
4.How about the mileage of the car in question (Ducato, Vivaro, Transit)?
5. Do the cars in question already have DPF / FAP filters?
6. How are the turbines doing in these cars?
7.And how is it with timing belts or where are the chains?

wojciechjanusz · Answer

As for the Transit (and the triplets with Ford PUMA engines): 1. Only some of the Transits from 2000-2011 had an ordinary wheel and only the front wheel drive. Models Mk7 (2006-2011) only 85 and 110hp 2.2L FWD had a single wheel, the rest were all dual weight. 2. Currently, a dual mass with a clutch can safely withstand a minimum of 200-250kkm, even in city driving. This is not a problem now ... 3. Transit is a popular car, there are plenty of good substitutes, so you can choose your stimulants wisely. 4. There is no rule here, it depends on the method of operation. I know the case of a Transit bus traveling on the Rzeszów-Munich route, with a mileage of 1 million km, was sold, and after 2 weeks it was on Oto-Moto with a mileage of 300kkm ... But the boorish construction team will whip the car completely at 200-300kkm. 5. Transity after 2011 (Siemens injection system) has DPF, not earlier. 6. There are no problems with the turbines at present, in 2006-2011 there were some complaints about the electric vgt control system as well as with the EGR. 7. Transit has a chain, with proper operation (good oil, timely replacement) it can last about 500kkm or more. The timing is maintenance-free. Transits from 2006-2011 with a more powerful Denso injection system (140KM), which were sharply chased on routes (most often a young boy and not the owner, the pedal in the floor, I saw a lot of videos on you-tube with a counter at 180 km / h) - there were broken pistons, which resulted in a burned hole in the piston and an engine overhaul. But it needs an exceptional butcher ...

adikojot1 · Answer

Ooo thanks .. !! :spoko: So summing up: Transits 2006-2011, i.e. those that I will most likely be looking for, front drive units have an ordinary clutch without a mass flywheel. The 2.4 engine, I understand, was only with dual mass. All Transits before 2011, whether from PL or from the foreign market, should be without DPF. Each engine is on a chain. If so, let me be honest that I did not consider Ford at all, and here I am.

wojciechjanusz · Answer

Not really - in the Mk7 only the two weakest engine versions. And that's exactly what it is like: Which Transits have a factory-fitted dual mass flywheel and which have a single, single mass flywheel. MK 6 (2000-2006) --------------------- 2.0 FWD engines 75KM - single 85KM - single 100KM - dual mass - manufactured until December 2001 100KM - single - manufactured after December 2001 125KM - dual mass 2.4 RWD engines All 2.4 have a dual mass wheel. A single flywheel can be installed on all 2.4 models using the Ford Repair Kit - except the 135HP tdci. 2.3 RWD petrol / gas-petrol engines Dual mass flywheel. There is no repair kit with conversion to single. MK 7 (2006-2011) ----------------- 2.2 FWD engines 85KM - single 110KM - single 115KM - dual mass 130KM - dual mass 140KM - dual mass 2.4 RWD engines All 2.4 are dual-mass 3.2 RWD engines All 3.2 are dual mass MK 7 (2011 - 2014) --------------- All engines are 2.2 (FWD, RWD and 4WD) and dual mass (with impulse torque limiter) MK 8 (2014 ->) -------------------------- All engines are 2.2 and dual mass (with impulse torque limiter)

adikojot1 · Answer

Gentlemen, today I watched 2 Ford Transits - I had the opportunity because it turned out that my friend uses 2 pcs.
He generally does not complain about the cars, but one of the cars, bought as a demo version in a showroom with a mileage of 5,000 km, shows the first signs of corrosion after 6 years - the car is said to have never been painted.
Tell me how you can, what is the case of corrosion on this car - it is secured with zinc, is it possible that the car, supposedly unpainted after 6 years after leaving the showroom, corrodes ..?

andrzej lukaszewicz · Answer

As a rule, the 6-year-old bus has already earned money for a long time and the owner has been leasing a new one for 2 years. This is the case abroad, with us it is very expensive scrap metal used by others for considerable money. Fords have never had strong sheet metal. Like 2 years ago, I bought an 8-year-old boxer in very good tinsmith condition and it immediately went to security, because in 2 years older I was taking the rotten thresholds apart with my hand. These are the realities.

wojciechjanusz · Answer

Well ... Fords Transits are corrosive, but whether more than other vans - I do not know. Watch the Sprinters.

I think that it all depends on the use, especially in winter, and the owner whether he will look under the car at least once a year and check what is going on there. If nobody has done anything for 6 years - corrosion will be there. Most vans in my opinion.
The bottom of the Transit is galvanized, but it doesn't do it all. Besides, you can see what is not the most important - that is, underneath, stringers, binders and other closed profiles. Also the floor at the wheel arches, the front seats under the carpeting and under the door seal at the bottom of the front steps and under the plastic steps. These are the critical places in these cars.

ALANAUTO · Answer

Which cars do the highest mileage?
Just look at the transport companies, what they drive.
Passenger transport - Trafic, Vivaro- 2.0 - 115KM reign supreme.
600-700,000 mileage without a problem and without renovation (of course, on the route), and the replacement of injections in these cars is usually caused by a minor manufacturing defect (bad sealing of the pit) and heavy rain, water flies on the engine and water the injectors - Repair - trouble-free with home and silicone .
Trafic / Vivaro drives like a passenger car and they are economical, so if you have 1 pallet to transport, there is no other alternative.
From other vans - this is what flies from companies to UE-Master, Ducato.
Somehow I don't see too many Crafters, Transits.
For 25,000 you can buy a nice Master 2007-2010, visually it looks average, but it does not rust and the engines are very good.
We have Traficiem 2010 2.0 Dci done 425,000 runs smoothly.
The master of the autolaweta - 320.000 - the engine and injections are not moved, once the bearing of the gearbox.
Ducato- nice car, but for PLN 25,000, it will be difficult to find a nice copy, just as it will be difficult to lease a car over 6 years old, and at this price, unfortunately, you have to look for such a car (unless you are interested in a younger, but car body).

wojciechjanusz · Answer

Late answer - I didn't notice. A bit off-topic, because the topic concerns the purchase of a used van, but generally it's about what you get for the money you spend and how these cars drive ... The latest Crafter or Sprinter should be compared with the latest Transit - right? Let it not be that I invent crap, because I am a Transit fanatic - I will post a post from the British Forum Tranista written by ... a Norwegian, who in addition is a car service employee and calmly compares the purchase of a Transit and a Sprinter without getting excited. Compare prices (Transit 30,100 euros, similar Sprinter 46,500 euros), accessories and opinions about it. In the last sentence, how does the Transit drive compared to the Sprinter ... I can give more similar opinions from various forums ... So that it wasn't that I'm making it up - the quote is from the link Generally: I am already a retired old man, I have traveled over 2.5 million km in various vans, I had my own transport company. Although I will probably not have the opportunity to drive the latest Sprinter or Crafter, I can definitely say that the Transit, compared to a similar van from another brand, drives by far the best and the driving pleasure for the driver is the greatest. Some models are not without flaws, even serious ones, but it does not change the fact that I stayed with Transit for the old years. I will repeat once again: in the case of Transit, for the money you put out, you certainly get the most ...

Kune · Answer

Exactly, you are quoting forum descriptions. What are they worth? Probably not much, since you did not have the opportunity to confront it with reality yourself. This forum is for you to advise based on your own experience, and not to repeat overheard opinions as yours saying:

wojciechjanusz wrote:
Generally, when you buy a Transit, you certainly get the most for the money you put in - there is no doubt. I have driven many vans - Transit drives by far the best of all vans (with a similar configuration) - driving pleasure and comfort are by far the greatest ...

So you can easily say that the Transit is the best delivery vehicle in the world according to your opinion.
If you think that the Transit 2006 is better and more comfortable than the Ducato 06-, then I'm really in a deep shock, or you just haven't had the opportunity to drive other cars (not to mention cars after 2010).

wojciechjanusz wrote:
Kune wrote:
You really drove the new Crafter and Sprinter and you think the Transit is more convenient and more comfortable ?? !! You are the only one I know and says so.
The latest Crafter or Sprinter should be compared with the latest Transit - right?

Saying the new Crafter / Sprinter I meant the model after 2006, which is not the so-called. CDI Sprinter only new model. So comparing it with Transit (2006) it's hard to repeat the already cited opinion:

wojciechjanusz wrote:
The Transit drives by far the best of all vans (of a similar configuration) - driving pleasure and comfort are by far the greatest

But that's not the point, I wouldn't bother with the Sprinter as well as with the Transit. Take a ride on the Transit, then the "Ducato Triplets" and Movano / Master, and you will notice a difference in driving that will only increase on the long haul.

I believe that the DUCATO is worth the money spent on it and it is such a popular car for a reason. Fail-safe, very good driving (even as MAXI over 160 km / h), especially in the POWER version with the most powerful engine.
We have a Transit Fitzel (professional tow truck) with a very rich equipment and in my opinion this car is far behind the Ducato and Master / Movano (not to mention the model III since 2010).

kakibara · Answer

Ford transit 2012, 125 hp dual-mass wheel and clutch replaced after 105 thousand km together with the engine damaged first piston, up to 200 thousand I have no problems with it, climate control navi cruise control, 6 gear rear drive, I drive and do not complain, quick wear of the blocks, brother-in-law has the largest transit 2.4 with the longest pack - it is driven by engine assembly workers, he also had no problems, and the driver changes every weekend - and they certainly do not care about the car and do not care about fuel - I do not pay the gas to the roof, sprinter 316 cdi max long time up, sitting like in a car a class higher, no air conditioning, I prefer to go on the route from 80 - 140 km / h, it accelerates like many TDI passenger cars, I am pissed off by the air vents from the front blowing strongly in the forehead if you live in the car has a meaning there is always a briefcase in my case a scarf some rag, engine box - no problem on the counter only 270,000 km, replacing a burnt tip with a plus from the battery - emergency firing, thermostat, which annoys me, I have a version with a smaller tank oh fuel. Peugeot Boxer 2.8 hdi 128 KM - with light loads and maxi body size I know only another engine more economical which I used to drive for a while on the Belgian army boxer maxi with 2.0 hdi 84 KM engine, side faults door guides handle replaced probably 4 times, clutch , 5th gear synchro, engine without problems, there were leaks but no problems with the accessories, you have a timing belt here,
for 25,000 you will buy a 2.2 or 2.3 HDI / JTD facelift - if you do not look at the appearance, I would prefer to buy a well-kept 2.8 hdi 128 KM with your gums and teas.
I am looking for a vivaro but 2.0 PB and I put on LPG for it, calculate the costs, read about the 2.0 PB engine from the renówka installed in triplets, my friend has versions for transporting disabled people made 450,000 km and has a gas installation that burns him from 11 to 15 liters of LPG. The problem in vivaro is the rear bearings, alternator, crates falling, 115 - there is no double weight, the engine lasts under 700 thousand km, quiet inside up to 150 km / h, 70% of carriers Poland Western Europe uses triplets, so it proves something.

Kune · Answer

For me, the replacement of the rear bearings (which started to roar) coincided with the replacement of the rear discs - as they are in Renault they come as a set, so it is not a common problem. silence from 150kkm, and when driving with a tow truck, the rear suspension and brakes get hard on the ass.

kakibara · Answer

Already, my friend KUNE, we discussed another topic, or quoting Me about the rear bearings - is an attempt on your part to show that there is no problem with the rear axle bearings in this model (I know perfectly well the topic of replacing and "trying" to insert a replacement bearing to reduce costs disc with a hub)? or are you just writing that you changed your bearings yourself?
Sharan 1.9 tdi 110KM AFN, on stool-hard seats with a tow truck, I made over 400,000 km, and I never replaced the brakes, discs, bearings at the back, and yes, the connectors at the front. Greetings.

Kune · Answer

I meant that the problem of bearings may not be too bothersome, because when replacing the discs, they are replaced together with the bearings, so depending on the driving style, every xxx xxx km, we will replace them anyway (when replacing the discs). I do not comment on extrusion of bearings in order to reduce costs, because I have never done it or even had such ideas :) I think Vivaro / Trafic has a little more on the hook than Sharan. A lot also depends on the cars that are pulled and the way they are loaded. In addition, Vivaro / Trafic often carries all goods apart from the tow truck, which is rather not practiced in Sharan.

ceiwo · Answer

If you want to have peace and trouble-free driving, I recommend the Toyota Hiace, maybe it does not have such a modern look as the exchanged buses, but I know what I am writing because I had such a new one. It is a car practically impossible to hit with a mileage of over 600,000, nothing special was made of the suspension, virgin from new, not moved, the engine burned to the touch, what to write a lot, the car is failure-free and problem-free !!!

Small Delivery Van for Food Products: Fiat Ducato vs Boxer vs Jumper vs Vivaro vs Crafter

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