Human touching of the phase and neutral conductors and effects

Hello,

I would like to ask a simple question what will be the effects of touching the phase and neutral conductors by a human.

A seemingly banal question? (at least for me, this seems to be the worst possible shock, the only receiver in this case is a human) but I have heard opinions that there are safeguards in such cases, is it really and how do they work?

The result will be an electrocution
Security measures are, but not always, and you can never be sure that they will work

feeling7 wrote:

it seems to be the worst possible paralysis, the only receiver in this case is a human

For me, however, this is not the worst hit ;)

feeling7 wrote:

I have heard opinions that there are safeguards in such cases, whether they actually work and how

What do you mean when it comes to RCDs is not exactly .... the only certainty is not to touch the electric wires

If a human caught L and N and couldn't free himself, there would be only one effect - death. There is no protection against such "catch" in installations. They would be pointless as they would not allow the operation of devices connected to the installation. For current, resistance is resistance. It doesn't matter if it's a human or a charger.

The worst thing is to be shocked by interfacial tension, to touch two phases at the same time.

My entire professional life was passed under the slogan ... "Be careful 25mA flowing through the body kills" ... When does such a current flow through a human? It is enough to remember about Ohm's law and know that the voltage in the network is 230 V. Maybe that something has changed now, because there are no RST markings anymore, "phase" and "zero" are not said ... the bulb shines so it shines although the voltage has increased by 10 V.

feeling7 wrote:

I would like to ask a simple question what will be the effects of touching the phase and neutral conductors by a human.

It depends on what you touch, what the path of the current will be through the body.
There is plenty of literature on this subject, have you taken the trouble to look for something?

Rezystor240 wrote:

The worst thing is to be shocked by interfacial tension, to touch two phases at the same time

This is also not the worst ;)

It's not about voltage, but about electricity and the way you touch it.

maziar1000 wrote:

Security measures are, but not always, and you can never be sure that they will work

And what kind of protection will work in this case?

gogi20 wrote:

If a human caught L and N and couldn't free himself, there would be only one effect - death.

Yes and no. It all depends on the transition resistance. I once met a "thick-skinned" electrician who, of course, under certain conditions, took the L wire in his fingers and he was fine.

To be clear, never do it at home because most of the time it is playing with death.

opornik7 wrote:

I once met a "thick-skinned" electrician who, of course, under certain conditions took the L wire in his fingers and he was fine

It does not have to be "thick-skinned", good insulation from the ground is enough ... as my colleague says: "the phase itself does not kick"

jaga134 wrote:

Just remember Ohm's Law

It is enough if we measure impedance and not the resistance (because it is AC) (at 50Hz).

You have to start with the fact that there is protection against direct and indirect contact and you should not mix it up.

Since you have touched a live part, it means the primary protection has failed, the question is why.

Strumien swiadomosci swia wrote:

Since you have touched a live part, it means the primary protection has failed, the question is why.

Nothing has failed, a colleague is doing an experiment and wants to consciously bypass security (in his mind for now).

jaga134 wrote:

It is enough to remember about Ohm's law and know that the voltage in the network is 230 V

And to know the resistance of the human body. It depends on the current emotional state (stressed - sweaty), on the thickness of the epidermis, on whether we are just after bathing in water with relaxing salts or playing in flour, whether we are wearing shoes and gloves, or maybe we fly naked or are we? sick or not ... and so on.

So just remembering about Om's Law won't help. One person's "average" impedance will be 1200 ohms, another 4500 ohms and the third will be 670 ohms.
so by answering the question:

feeling7 wrote:

I would like to ask a simple question, what will be the effects of touching the phase and neutral conductors by a person

The result will be a shock current flow on the touch line.
If it is a hand-to-hand or hand-to-leg flow, or any other flow on the line where the heart is, we have two situations:
Tissue damage due to thermal reasons (the body is "mainly" the resistance on which heat is released) and "damage" due to frequency reasons - cardiac arrest.
So a burn, a heart attack, a heart attack and a burn will kill us.
The duration of such destruction is an important factor here.

feeling7 wrote:

I have heard opinions that there are safeguards in such cases, are they really and how do they work?

There are no devices that would protect humans in such a way, mainly due to the fact that it is impossible to universally "program" the impedance range of the human body.

Once again for those who are not kumatych: it kills the current flowing through the human body, its value is 25mA. This current value can be obtained at a voltage of 230-250 V when the resistance / resistance of our skin is 1000 Ohm. For comparison: a typical 3.5V light bulb from a flashlight with a supply voltage of 4.5V consumes a current, i.e. a current of 200mA flows through it. So how little it takes to go to another dimension, aha, by the way. The current, whether direct or alternating, flows anyway, regardless of whether it encounters impedance or resistance, and it does not matter whether a person dies from blood electrolysis or from fibrillation of the heart chambers. Believe me, it will be a corpse in both cases.

jaga134 wrote:

KILLS THE CURRENT FLOWING THROUGH THE HUMAN BODY.

Not.
They kill the effects of this flow and the amount of power released on the tissues.

jaga134 wrote:

Believe me, it will be a corpse in both cases.

In the absence of medical assistance, it is probably 99% of deaths.

Added to all this is the question of frequency, which means that the issue is very broad. Thousands of publications have been written on this subject, and there will be many more, and our deliberations here are necessarily very messy and hopelessly bland.

I close the topic, for a possible discussion of the details (specific sections) of the topic, you must first get to know the basics of the issue, rediscovering America does not make sense.