[Solved] Vaillant Calormatic 470: Clock Settings Lost, Possible Battery Issue? SR516 Battery Spots?

Calormatic 470. For 2 months, he has been losing his watch settings after a few minutes of turning off the power. Before, it even lasted several hours.

On the board I can clearly see a watch battery fi approx. 5mm, thickness approx. 1mm, with a heated plate to the + terminal, the terminal - is soldered directly to the plate or a very short plate is heated there. The voltage on it drops quickly from about 1.2V to 0.43V.
I wonder if it's a silver battery. If so, the soldering method indicates that the battery has been overheated at the factory, and batteries do not like it. Which would explain that it was in operation for exactly 1.5 years.

Despite this, the service of the main Vaillant representative office claims that: "There is no clock backup in this controller." What is the battery there for?
There are 2 solder spots for SR516 batteries :)

I'll add a photo in a moment.

The datasheet of the STM32F101xE processor, on which this driver is based, shows that the voltage from 1.8 to 3.6V should be supplied to leg 6 to power the RTC and backup registers. The 1.55v SR516 silver battery used by Vaillant or any subcontractor does not meet the minimum voltage specification. Not to mention the fact that when soldering this battery, it overheated and shortened its life. The (factory) defect, and a serious one, is the lack of a diode with a barrier towards the battery, which prevents it from charging. SR and CR batteries are not rechargeable and may explode or leak. I think it was charging that damaged the battery more than overheating it during soldering.

Because the SR516 had heated plates for its soldering, it was not possible to easily replace it. I don't have such a small welding machine. I modified it by adding a CR2032 battery socket, like those from motherboards. It will fit on the right side of the LCD so that the entire housing can be closed. Of course, SR516 needs to be desoldered.
If we are going to use a CR2032 battery, we need to add a barrier, i.e. a diode, in the direction of the battery to +, so that the battery is not charged. The producer somehow forgot about it.
If we use a LIR2032 battery, then this diode is not needed. LIR2032 has a voltage of 3.6V and should be charged with U=4.2V, so you would need to make a system that would increase the voltage towards the battery. There is only 3.3V on the controller. LIR2032 has only 40mAh and CR2032 as much as 240mAh. LIR2032 withstands 500 charging cycles, CR2032 lives on clock support for about 10 years. You choose what you want.

In my opinion, this controller has one more disadvantage, the thermistor for measuring the room temperature is behind the LCD, the backlight of which heats it up and with prolonged manipulation on the controller, it starts to catch a higher temperature, even by 2 ° C.
You can move this thermistor on cables to the edge of the board and it's ok.

That's it. Thank you for your attention.

PS If someone is disassembling their calormatic 470, see if you have the same defects and let me know.
IMHO Someone messed up with this driver, the software also has errors.

Recently, two of my clients reported to me during a boiler inspection that the CalorMatic 470 regulator does not keep the date and time. The funniest thing is that one customer at home has this problem, and his son in the house next door does not have it, let me add that both were bought and installed at the same time and in both cases the power outages are the same! ?!?

I contacted the Vaillant technical department and they said that this is a normal situation because the regulator does not have a backup power supply for the variable memory (date and time). The regulator should be powered all the time. If users live in an area with frequent power outages, an appropriate UPS (full sine wave) or an outdoor temperature sensor with a DCF receiver should be purchased.

I greet and also ask all users for their own opinions.

Maintaining the clock in this regulator is the most and the RTC clock is also in the processor. Just look at the datasheet of this processor.

From what you write, I suspect that Vaillant knows about the problem and is ignoring it for now. They claim that there is no clock regulator or clock backup in this. And they want to get rid of people that way. They make fun of it completely. I wonder if this is the official position of Vaillant headquarters on this issue .

Unfortunately, I also encountered this problem. I bought the regulator in August 2014 and it worked well last season. Currently, every power failure resets the clock setting.
The authorized service in Krakow does not take the glove and sent me back to the manufacturer.
There I heard that Vaillant does not guarantee the clock support in this regulator model and some other interesting facts.
I was suggested to buy a UPS :)

It is a pity that Vaillant does not inform about such matters in the catalog card of its most expensive regulator, but leaves such surprises.

winyl2 wrote:

The 1.55v SR516 silver battery used by Vaillant or any subcontractor does not meet the minimum voltage specification. Not to mention the fact that when soldering this battery, it overheated and shortened its life. The (factory) defect, and a serious one, is the lack of a diode with a barrier towards the battery, which prevents it from charging. SR and CR batteries are not rechargeable and may explode or leak. I think it was the charging that damaged the battery more than its overheating during soldering...

...IMHO Someone messed up with this driver, the software also has errors.

Did you even think for a second what kind of utter nonsense you're writing? What battery?!? You probably didn't even want to take an ordinary magnifying glass to read the symbols on this supposed battery, right? You would then discover that the symbols SM-414 and the name KORCHIP entered in Google will lead you to the catalog note of this element and you would then know that it is not a battery but a so-called. supercapacitor with a capacity of 0.07 F (Farad) and an operating voltage of 2.7 [V], and that the manufacturer allows a soldering temperature of 260 degrees Celsius. So your whole overheating and battery charging conspiracy theory just burst like a soap bubble.

By the way - you haven't noticed the diode soldered next to this supposed battery, which causes the capacitor to charge when the regulator is connected to the voltage, and prevents it from discharging when the regulator does not get power from the eBUS.

Of course, this capacitor has the right to stop working like any other electronic element and there is nothing strange about it, but I do not recommend soldering or connecting batteries in its place, horror of horrors, what a strange idea!!! But maybe it's better to replace the supercapacitor with a supercapacitor?

Of course he has the right, but it's raining way too fast and replacing it for an ordinary Kowalski won't be easy.
Where can you buy such a supercapacitor?

It turned out that the regulator is covered by a two-year warranty period. I finally got to an authorized service that cares about the customer. The regulator was replaced by a service technician under warranty for a new one.
It works for now

Gentlemen, what capacitor can replace this supercapacitor? I also have a problem with wasting time.

SM414 can be purchased in Poland.


Data:
===================
North.pl Wojciech Pobrotyn
st. Wąwozowa 7b
75-339 Koszalin
-------------------------------------------------- -----
No. cat. 625-HK-0161
0.07F | 3.3V Electrolytic capacitor back-up SAMSUNG 2409-001172
price: 3.99
Shipping cost: PLN 9.99
----------------------

SM 414 Korchip was sent
============================

And then solder (I did it with a regular 24W soldering iron, only quickly so as not to overheat the capacitor) as in the picture. It works.

I ordered from Chinese but thanks for the info

http://s.aliexpress.com/beYVBvmE

Erbit wrote:

nanbu78 wrote:

... its replacement for an ordinary Kowalski will not be easy.
...

It's not an argument. An ordinary Kowalski is supposed to use, not service.

Previous posts show something completely different.

Hello,
I have the same problem. They sell products that are expensive and not worth the investment.

Hello,

I have the same problem
A bit of linden in equipment for several hundred zlotys that a little after two years the clock support stops working.
Has anyone been able to get a free/paid repair from vaillant??

Is it only left to roll up your sleeves and replace this supercapacitor yourself?

lukas_m wrote:

Has anyone been able to get a free/paid repair from vaillant??

Is it only left to roll up your sleeves and replace this supercapacitor yourself?

They probably won't replace anyone, because "this regulator does not have volatile memory support", and even more so they do not repair it (because it is integrated with the board, and they do not repair electronics).

lukas_m wrote:

Is it only left to roll up your sleeves and replace this supercapacitor yourself?

I think so.

Thanks for the answer.

Has anyone on the forum ever replaced this capacitor? Does this actually solve the problem?

Regards

I have a question,
Can a faulty supercapacitor in "calormatics" be replaced with, for example:
1P 5.5V ?
and mount on the wires?
Is the "plus" in the photo in the post col. jack-77 it is on this plate welded in three places, I can't read it ...?
I understand that the old supercapacitor does not need to be removed?

Thanks for the answer.

lukas_m wrote:

Thanks for the answer.

Has anyone on the forum ever replaced this capacitor? Does this actually solve the problem?

Regards

I replaced it and it works.
Bought on Aliexpress link I have 9 left.

OKAY,
I'll answer a bit myself.
As for the capacitor, I used 5.5v 0.22F - it works without any problems, connected to the wires, glued with double-sided tape, there is a lot of space to put it somewhere on the side.
It is worth desoldering the old capacitor, it is not known what was damaged in it, I made this assumption.

Also, to sum up, any supercapacitor with a voltage of not less than 3.3V can be used and it must work. As for the capacitance of 0.07F, it seemed small to me, so I increased it, but it's a matter of taste.

uri wrote:

I replaced it and it works.
Bought on Aliexpres Link, I still have 9 pcs left.

Could I buy one back?

The problem seems to be common, so I want to share my experience. After 2 years of operation, the CALORMATIC 470 stopped keeping the date. After a few minutes of power outage, the data was erased. Which, of course, resulted in the fact that the time programs were "in the head". After a year of struggling with this problem, I decided to do something. Even by replacing the driver. Thanks to jacek-77's post, I was able to solve the problem for a few zlotys. According to the instructions, in place of the damaged one, I installed a 0.22F 5.5V capacitor (http://nowyelektronik.pl/index.php?id_product=82029&controller=product?search_query=0.22F&fast_search=fs) and it works. The 12-hour backup test was successful. How I did it - in the pictures. When removing the old capacitor, there were casualties, the cake under the minus tore off (surface mounting). Maybe the soldering iron should have been hotter? But there was no problem next to it there is an additional field for soldering "-". I glued the capacitor to the board with glue in a place where there are no paths and outside the area occupied by the display. It works!

good morning gentlemen (and maybe ladies),

I think I have a similar problem, but I got stuck earlier - on the painless opening of this driver. How to get to it?

Regards

A beautiful read taken straight from the descriptions regarding the maintenance of the clock (timer) in VCRs. There was also the so-called supercapacitors, but they lasted more than two years. In mine - about seven. Instead, I used three ordinary 1.5V batteries, type R6 (4.5V) with one diode soldered in the reverse direction, which cured the whole device of its flaws. I used the first treatment in 1998. Thanks to the diode, there is no question of a possible attempt to recharge the battery. To this day, the video recorder (usually disconnected / turned off from the power source) correctly shows the time and other settings. I just connected it to the power supply, because actually, as it is not in use, it is disconnected from the power supply. It shows 2:03 (winter time) so: it still works as it should. The clock is not set, so it has the right to be a little late or in a hurry.
A simple and very effective solution.
I'm afraid this solution will cure your problems one hundred percent.
Best regards to the author of the thread and its participants.
I think I helped

mlody_woj wrote:

good morning gentlemen (and maybe ladies),

I think I have a similar problem, but I got stuck earlier - on the painless opening of this driver. How to get to it?

Regards

At the top, above the word Vaillant, there is a gap. Insert a flathead screwdriver and gently pull it towards you

stm1 wrote:

At the top, above the word Vaillant, there is a gap. Insert a flathead screwdriver and gently pull it towards you

Looking at the screen? I do, but it won't let go. I don't want to break it, because this plastic seems to be quite brittle...

Thanks I will try...

Hello.
I'm a bit from a different story but in connection with SM414. Well, my daughter recently told me that her Fujifilm ZJ100 camera does not remember the time and other settings when turned off. Due to the fact that the camera is long out of warranty, I decided to take it apart. It turned out that there is a SM414 "battery" in the camera. And now the question is whether it is a capacitor for 100%, because the device "poured out" like an old battery, and besides, it has a voltage of 0.4V all the time - of course too small to maintain the memory and would the capacitor perform the task of maintaining the settings?
Second question, where can I buy such batteries. The size of this "battery" is f4.8mm and the thickness is 1.65 and it looks like a SR416SW button cell. And here comes the third question whether I can use the SR416SW instead of the old "battery". Thank you for your help.