2-Wire Installation: Socket with Pin Connection - Neutral Wire, Bridge, Old-Type Setup, Safety

Recently, I have faced a problem, namely there is a (old type) two-wire installation, where we have a socket with a pin, for which we should perform 0-ripping in order to protect the metal housings of devices plugged into such a socket.

Generally, it is recommended to connect the neutral wire to the pin first and to make a bridge from this pin to the working contact in the socket (a hole in the socket for the neutral wire).


However, I have heard opinions that the neutral cable that goes directly to the hole in the socket (neutral working contact) can be released with a bridge on the pin, i.e. like this crossed diagram.
I even asked an electrician who told me that this diagram (crossed out) is correct and that you can do it. I also found myself practicing O-socket like this, so that people did and continue to do so.

Reading, they ask, I became dumbfounded. After all, how should you properly 0-wire the socket in a two-wire installation, first connecting the neutral wire with the pin, and then with the bridge to the socket hole (working contact), is it possible to connect the hole directly and make the bridge with the pin?
If the correct way is to connect the pin first and the bridge to the hole then WHY? A simple explanation, maybe with an example, because I did a loop.
The more I start to wonder, even this correct concept (the picture is not crossed out) has disadvantages, because with such a solution a potential may appear on the housing.

Your "electrician" does not even know the principle that we protect first, then power it.
The world goes to the dogs.
And you do not connect the neutral wire to the pin, because the neutral is simply not there.

Here you have everything. It was discussed hundreds of times.

According to the crossed out drawing, it used to be when you first powered up and then protected. Then came reflection, because when the zero "hole" gets hot, it turned out that a phase appeared on the casing through a pin! So the approach was changed and the neutral wire is connected first to the pin, and the bridge to the "hole" - in the event of blown zero on the plug, there will still be some protection.

However, it is strongly recommended to replace such an installation with a modern one - old installations did not provide for such a large number of receivers and they simply do not withstand. At worst, it'll just kick a little or burn a can or two. But maybe I will not quote a worse time.

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According to the crossed out drawing, it used to be when you first powered up and protected it.

Not true. It was never allowed to do that.

rodecro wrote:

we have a socket with a pin for which 0-rooting should be performed

I will ask by the way - is this network system known to my colleague?
Because only one can be reset.

Maybe an offtop,
But for some time I have been bothered by the question:
Protective pin or Pin
In the literature, I definitely encountered a protective colony.
And I have never met a woman who would know what a protective pin is, only a pin in their head ?
And you, gentlemen and ladies, what term do you use? ?

If anything, a peg, not a col. [retrofood]

fotzsyzrk wrote:

Protective pin or Pin
In the literature, I definitely encountered a protective colony.

SJP PWN defines it as follows:
1. hurt alias bolt
2. pin
Nothing from the electrical industry there.
But here it is - contact

rodecro wrote:

Recently, I had to deal with a problem, namely there is a (old type) two-wire installation, where we have a socket with a pin, for which 0-rooting should be performed

And how can you be sure that you need to reset, and if the network system is TT? this reset does not exist.

A specific answer was given by Andzrej42, it can be seen that the guest knows each other and such a person would be able to talk to a customer, even one who needs to be explained something in a simple, understandable language. And this is the answer I meant, because as I wrote, I have encountered situations where sources in the network say about a pin-to-bridge-hole approach, but there are even electricians who continue to practice the wrong scheme, that they make a bridge from the pin-hole.

Andrzej's answer is short, but concrete others have entered into a polemic whether something metal protruding from the socket should be called a pin or a pin, because everyone understands what it is about, it is not an instruction for a device that is to be sold on the market and there there should be an expert name for it. I asked about something completely different, and I get some strange thoughts from you.

Elpapiotr, as you explain, explain it carefully:

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And you do not connect the neutral wire to the pin, because the neutral is simply not there.

Then tell me what is the PEN conductor in old TN-C installations, isn't it a common protective-neutral conductor? After all, it is a conductor that combines the functions of the protective earth conductor (PE) and the neutral conductor (N).

rodecro wrote:

A specific answer was given by Andzrej42, it can be seen that the guest knows each other and such a person would be able to talk to a customer, even one who needs to be explained something in a simple, understandable language. And this is the answer I meant, because as I wrote, I have encountered situations where sources in the network say about a pin-to-bridge-hole approach, but there are even electricians who continue to practice the wrong scheme, that they make a bridge from the pin-hole.

You read a friend's post @ jann111 ? There is a picture, there is a description of the risk for each situation. What more could you ask for?

rodecro wrote:

Then tell me what is the PEN conductor in old TN-C installations, isn't it a common protective-neutral conductor? After all, it is a conductor that combines the functions of the protective earth conductor (PE) and the neutral conductor (N).

It is a conductor that combines the function of a protective and neutral conductor, once known as the neutral conductor.
Today, this cable does not have its proper name due to the failure to meet the minimum cross-section requirement for the PEN conductor. This is a cross-sectional area of 10 square millimeters for copper or 16 square millimeters for aluminum.

1. Remember that there are no network systems for old-time electricians. They do the usual bridge from N to PE.
2. Reset can be performed only when the network system is TN and the apartment / flat installation is 2-wire.
3. Let's give up on these systems, electricians know what it is, and that others cannot understand them, this is their problem.
4. There were hundreds of topics about resetting.

correct jan111 also gave an interesting picture, therefore + for him as great as Russia itself.

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3. Let's give up on these systems, electricians know it, and that others cannot understand them, that's their problem.
4. There were hundreds of topics about the breakup.

There were hundreds and that's why people are confused because one expert says yes, and completely different info on the web. Therefore, you cannot approach the matter in such a way that the electrician knows and that someone does not know is his problem. When you go to the client, he will say that they used to make a bridge from a pinhole (0-rowanie), and you are making a pin into a pinhole and he will ask why you are doing this, you should explain it to the client clearly and convince him that it is now correct and safely. An answer in the style of Andrzej42 would be understandable and convincing for most people, supported by the depiction of jana111, certainly reassuring, but if you will not be able to explain in an understandable language to someone who is not an electrician what you do, and with ignorance you will treat people with it and you will not have orders. You need to be able to talk to people. You don't know everything either. Otherwise, you will form a reputation for being one that no one will want to take.

I consider the topic closed, I found out what I was looking for.

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Remember that there are no network systems for old-time electricians. They do the usual bridge from N to PE.

Not true. And as a representative of the "new date", the colleague may not see, but the neutral conductor was always connected to the protective terminal and only this contact was connected with the working contact of the socket without cutting the neutral conductor.
Never otherwise.

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Let's give up on these systems, electricians know it, and the fact that others cannot understand them is their problem.

No buddy, it's not just their problem. Especially when this issue is discussed in the section for beginners.
And you have to roll it until the questions about it disappear.

I will say more.
In rooms, when installed in a loop and 2-wire cables, the wires were not cut, even for double sockets glued to concrete (drill type)

kkas12 wrote:

Not true. And as a representative of the "new date", the colleague may not see, but the neutral conductor was always connected to the protective terminal and only this contact was connected with the working contact of the socket without cutting the neutral conductor.

I will not agree here. Because a long time ago I talked with some older electricians who, hearing about the topic of zeroing, did not ask about the network layout, but replied that you need to make a bridge from 0 to the pin. And how will your colleague interpret it? Of course, as I know this is a wrong approach, but what to expect from ferns. One even replied that 0 is 0 dot.

kkas12 wrote:

No buddy, it's not just their problem. Especially when this issue is discussed in the section for beginners.
And you have to roll it until the questions about it disappear.

So until New Year's Eve all in all, it's not long now.

Buddy, because resetting clearly defined the type of network at that time.
One way to protect against electric shock was grounding, and the other was grounding.