House monitoring - IP or AHD? What kind of recorder and cameras?

Question

Monitoring of a two-story house and garden. There is a dedicated twisted pair for all planned camera mounting points. The maximum cable distances are 25 m. I know about networks and connecting hardware by Ethernet is not a problem. All cameras should be at least HD (1080). It can be factory PoE...

sosarek · Answer

Good, just do not forget to set up the Intruzie stand in front of the camera and look at it, preferably from a distance of 1-1.5 meters. So do not count on it, especially if the camera is not in front of an oncoming vehicle, mounted at the appropriate height. A dozen or so - how many - 10? thirty? 50 meters? It will archive on the disk mounted inside, if you have such requirements, do not count on budget solutions. Why? AHD, CVI, TVI will be better quality than cheap IP, additionally solutions are still supported and modernized. It depends on which standard you choose, generally the most universal are hybrids. If you want to have any support, etc., it's probably obvious that in the country. Good company, look at TurboHD Hika. And most importantly - give budget for the whole.

suworow · Answer

9 years already with us and a friend did not realize that it is not a shop, but a technical forum ?. Just like a colleague wrote, please specify the budget first and suggest some hardware solutions that we would like to evaluate. greetings

Jan_Werbinski · Answer

The point is to register with quality sufficient for identification. My cheap camera for PLN 100 in a car can do it from several meters. Can not be compensated by the resolution, the approach to the driveway and the narrow viewing angle? Between 11 and 19. On average, 12-15. So, for example, I have to hook up and copy once a week? There are no cheap backup options under ftp or simply copying the directory to a given network address? From what price does it start? Some producers have reportedly cease production of equipment for concentrates. Some cameras have identical prices for both versions. Most of the articles I've read write that IP is the future, and AHD is legacy, backward compatibility with old cabling. If I do not have old cables then why go into old technologies? So buy a hybrid and connect both systems? I do not have any cameras yet. What can compatibility with me back? I will save on higher-end cameras? There is no budget. For example, the recorder for 1000 is the average option. If I have to spend more, I would have to know what I pay for. These cameras are better, for example, 300-700, and cheaper, for example, 100-200 PLN. Added after 4 [minutes]: As I already wrote 1000 for the recorder is the version from which I start. If it is to be more expensive then I would have to know why. A good camera is several hundred, 300-700 PLN. I do not want more expensive ones. I prefer to wait a few years for new technologies. Cheap cameras are 100-200. So that with six cameras (two expensive and four cheap), the initial budget is 2,600 zlotys. It may change, for example, to 4000, but if I have to pay for something that in three years will be half cheaper, I prefer to buy cheaper and replace in three years. Initially there will be a recorder and two cameras for the test. Then I'll buy more. Maybe give me an idea of where to start and after the first experience I will know what I want? I'm more inclined towards IP technology.

suworow · Answer

And a colleague of the sauce maker rightly directs his colleague to the technology of analogue high resolution, where for half the price (that is, within 300-700 PLN) we get quite decent cameras. You can know what arguments in the opinion of a colleague speak for IP?

sosarek · Answer

Especially in the balaclava and hood - people, a little more common sense. Instead of an array after dark you will have a white rectangle. So definitely cameras with an adjustable lens (maybe with 3Mpx motozoom from Hika?). The recorder writes in a loop on the local disk, for 1000 PLN you can not buy anything that allows simultaneous backup on the network or on external media. I wonder who this bit of nonsense is - technologies are constantly being developed (even if 5Mpx is not a problem after the focus), cop to prices - they are completely different. Contrary to appearances, IP is developing slower than other technologies, and AHD, CVI, TVI, ba - even analogs you go through the twisted pair without any problems (video baluns / transformers are enough). Virtually all (not counting typical NVRs) are hybrids. It is not backward compatibility and support for many solutions - do not confuse. For the quality. The better it is 600-900netto, what's cheaper and the budget you presented - I will comment this way hahaha, stop joking. See, for example, DS-7208HGHI-SH / A, DS-2CE56D1T-VFIR3 .

Jan_Werbinski · Answer

I compared the quality of analog and IP monitors live. Analogue clearly loses in terms of image quality at the same resolution, but there are no delays.
Recorders cost practically the same.
What is the reason for the worse quality of analog HD? Noise?

Is it true that the 720p cameras are better after dark? Current is in 2017?

sosarek · Answer

Nonsense, how little ... The transducer used is very important, its sensitivity, conditions prevailing in a given place, etc.

Jan_Werbinski · Answer

I did not compare specific types of cameras, checking their prices and parameters. I used to provide an installer or user. I noticed that older people prefer analog - experience, and younger IP - openness to new technologies.

Unshielded UTP cat 5 cable for monitoring goes in parallel with 230 and 400V electrical wires. I'm afraid of interference.

I think that I will start with the purchase of the recorder and two cameras and then with the next experience. One external bullet is to guard the area and the car in front of the house at a distance of 6m. At night there is strong light from streetlights.
The second one is a dome or wall camera like an intercom mounted above the entrance door or next to them and looking straight ahead - recognition of the face from a distance of 40cm to 4m, etc. Placed under the roof, but the rain splashes will also be external.

The difference of PLN 300 between an analog or IP camera is not important to me. I do not want the financial argument to be decisive.
An important advantage of the IP recorder is that thanks to the smaller number of cables it can be more easily secured against theft.
Apart from its traditional role, monitoring is also intended to be fun and to learn. If a technology allows me more functions, it is also an advantage for me. For example, determining the area of motion detection, connecting with the alarm system, etc.

Thus, apart from financial aspects. Which Turbo HD or IP technology to choose in a similar price class PLN 1000 for the recorder, eg in the Hikvision offer?
Hybrid recorders have only one or two IP ports, and the rest analog. It's not exactly what I mean.

sosarek · Answer

The parameters are the most important. I am not afraid of over 15 years in the industry and new solutions, but IP is still being developed, it is not fully developed. At what distance from these voltage cables? As for the disturbances - they can sometimes be eliminated in a simple way if they occur. The difference between a good quality TVI and IP can be up to 3 times as much. With other solutions, you have the same number of cables (one twisted pair of vision from one of the two cameras, the remaining ones have been powered. By the way, the recorder is mounted in a place that is rather difficult to access, and not on the closet in the hallway What, Solitaire? The detection area for analog solutions is implemented from the recorder level, in the case of IP the case gets complicated. What to connect with the alarm system - no problem, only question how you imagine this integration (what tasks should be fulfilled). Apparently, the budget does not matter, but in advance you set up 1k for the recorder - TurboHD from Hika. There are other solutions, but a lot more expensive.

Jan_Werbinski · Answer

UTP cables go in the same furrow contacting 230V on a length of up to 20 m.
An eight-channel analogue recorder has a minimum of 9 cables. The same IP recorder is two cables that can easily be moved to another location.
The monitoring is to be used to learn how to install and service monitoring, to form an opinion on its use.
Integration with the alarm system is, for example, sending a violation signal to the forbidden zone, that is, duplicating what the ordinary sensor does. Does it make sense? I have my doubts.
There are also IP recorders for 1200-3000. You write to suggest some equipment I suggest. Hikvision I saw in action and it's OK. Prices reasonable. PoE, I would prefer to have one at a time.
The budget does not matter in the sense that I can contribute to more expensive equipment if he offers something for me. I prefer to buy something more expensive which suits me, for example, at the expense of the fact that initially there will be fewer cameras.

suworow · Answer

I admit that I read with increasing interest You can count on the development of these threads. greetings

Jan_Werbinski · Answer

These hybrid recorders, whose parameters I read, were able to connect only one or two IP cameras and the rest hybrid. I misunderstood?
PoE I will make a separate switch, and I will not use the built-in recorder. To make it mobile and easy to secure. The IP cable goes to the power and ethernet cable. I forgot something?

suworow · Answer

Ok now better. From what he wrote earlier, it was possible to deduce that the number of IP cameras supported by the hybrid recorder depends on how many Ethernet ports he has. The issue of the number of cables explains the info that just puts a colleague put the switch in a different place than the recorder itself.
Back to the topic. IP technology offers a lot more possibilities, in many cases it facilitates wiring. The installer theoretically does not even need to know what are voltage drops, ground loop, etc. The fact that each device is an independent entity allows you to log in to each of them separately, easily add a second recorder, etc. But as the sauce maker says and problems that could not even be mentioned in analog systems. Equipment hangs, problems with motion detection. With one or two simple installations, you may not hit them, but when you do more, you start to deal with them. Examples? On the devices of one of the leading brands, with the recording of motion detection set, one day the registration simply stopped. In another place, after logging in from the mobile device, the auxiliary stream parameters changed ...
greetings

Hitorek · Answer

Additional functions for fun and learning as it was determined for IP and analogue recorders are the same. So the choice of technology in which you perform the monitoring depends only and exclusively on the cabling and the places where the devices are to be - cameras, recorder, power supplies and possibly for IP switches. For Analog, video signals from each camera must be made to the recorder, while in IP it is enough to collect the switch point and one cable to the recorder, which gives a little more flexibility if it is no longer able to provide cables.

Jan_Werbinski · Answer

Time has shown that analog monitoring is a walking corpse. Two years have passed and analogue technology has almost been replaced by IP monitoring. It seems to me that distrust of IP results from the reluctance of installers to update knowledge about Ethernet and networks. Fortunately, I did not listen to you and I went into IP technology.

suworow · Answer

Two years ago a colleague wrote more or less the same Only that these technologies seem to be slightly younger than IP technology So in a row: We are talking about monitoring system on several cameras. The colleague tell me what a huge knowledge of the network you need to have to run such a system? After which does a colleague claim that IP technology is newer than analog technologies of high-resolution video transmission? What limitations would a colleague get beyond those we talked about two years ago if he had not chosen IP technology Can a colleague cite information regarding the sale of particular types of systems? greetings

xury · Answer

You probably think that analog CCTV installers are darker and can not set IP addresses, redirections, etc. However, you must admit that before the IP cameras appeared, they were long analog CCTV and surprisingly there was a network and redirection and there was no P2P clouds set with one click.

marek216 · Answer

Time has shown that analog monitoring is developing. Initially AHD, then introduced CVI and TVI. Time has also shown that in the analogue one can play high resolution image, which, using high quality transducers, competes with IP cameras calmly. As for the reluctance, the installer is indifferent to what he hangs, worse with the client as he sees the costs. The other thing is the efficiency of the network using a preview of 16 IP cameras, and in the remote version outside it is a championship, I skip geniuses who want to let this through GSM because the operator miracles in LTE promises.

Jan_Werbinski · Answer

Just look at the number of camera offers on Allegro:
https://allegro.pl/kategoria/telewizja-przemy...37?bmatch=baseline-n-cl-eyesa-bp-ele-1-1-0619
IP 11865
the remaining together 15272/7 category = 2181 on average.

Same sorting but looking for the word Hikvision.
IP 3094
The rest of 2965.

Dahua
2541 IP,
1951 other technologies.

IP is the most comprehensive. The same on other sites. Most IP cameras from different manufacturers will work together, which can hardly be said about different analog standards.
Signal processing options are another advantage of IP. With analogues, you are doomed to recorders and average solutions or to one camera manufacturer. IP means freedom in the selection of producers and advanced methods of image analysis at an affordable price.

Analog technology is a corpse.

dawidedziu · Answer

As to the indifference is the will of IP - I make a quicker plug-in, the twisted-up twisted pairs of tricks and attached to the switch look neater. Performance is ok, I have not noticed problems with 16 cameras, and even at 30. I also have no problems with viewing via GSM - and so one camera is displayed on a single preview at once. There are hybrids - they work. No. There is something like this with IP - one hardware manufacturer is indicated. The first part, unfortunately, is not true, the second part is so ...

damiaan22 · Answer

Traditional IP has worked well for me. All the equipment helped me choose EC System Krakow and it works flawlessly. I didn't know much about all these differences between systems, but the gentlemen explained everything and presented a favorable offer. .

Infam · Answer

I have little resistance to writing in this topic, because you can treat me as a technical ignorant; I will also opt for an IP system although (or maybe because) CCTV is a bit of a magic for me. I am planning a small system, rather an economic version for a recreational plot. I mainly want to know if there was any uncontrolled interference in the plot (in particular, whether there were any fishing from the pond). There is approx. 30 m between the house and the pond in a straight line and I have 230V (YKY 3x2,5) and currently unused UTP cat. 5 approx. 40 mb in the ground, cables at a distance of 10..15 cm from each other). YKY goes only up to 40 W aerator in the pond (continuous operation in the winter season), but an additional 1.5 kW watering pump will be connected securely). I do not know if I should expect any interference (it remains to be seen in the wash). I plan to mount one camera at the pond, and in time maybe the other on the opposite side of this small pond, distance to this

House monitoring - IP or AHD? What kind of recorder and cameras?

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