logo elektroda
logo elektroda
X
logo elektroda

Can adding RAM mess up the BIOS? A simple laptop upgrade that got complicated

p.kaczmarek2 219 9
ADVERTISEMENT
Treść została przetłumaczona polish » english Zobacz oryginalną wersję tematu
📢 Listen (AI):
  • Can adding RAM mess up the BIOS? A simple laptop upgrade that got complicated
    An interesting service story today. Can swapping 4 GB RAM for 8 GB damage a laptop so that it can no longer even boot or install the operating system? I have personally found out that this is possible - here I will show what happened and present the solution to the problem. Does your laptop not boot after an upgrade attempt, does not see the USB drive with the system, does not boot the system even though it can see the drive? This is the topic for you.
    Can adding RAM mess up the BIOS? A simple laptop upgrade that got complicated
    The patient is a Lenovo B5400 laptop. On the one hand it's already quite old, several years old, still from the Windows 8 era, based on a dual-core Intel Pentium 3550M, but on the other hand it's well-preserved, with no scratches, a full set of hardware and a holding battery. It could still be suitable for social media, browsing the internet and making payments.
    The only problem is that lukewarm SSHD drive and the measly 4 GB of RAM. Especially as that 4 GB is in the form of a single bone, and the replacement SSD I already have in stock from liquidation....
    Can adding RAM mess up the BIOS? A simple laptop upgrade that got complicated
    I started with this RAM. Something tempted me to try with two 8GB bones each. I guess that's silly, as RAM prices are knocking down, but everyone has different hobbies. I matched the two matching dice. Of course I disconnected the battery before running. With the 2x8 GB configuration the laptop wouldn't get up, and after running 4 + 8 GB there was an unusual problem. The laptop stopped booting Windows even though the drive was seen. I checked the standard stuff:
    - second SATA media, second SATA port (I have a drive bay for the CD/DVD slot)
    - booting from USB (Linux)
    - bIOS settings, legacy, fastboot
    - cMOS reset (battery)
    Nothing wanted to work, so I decided to revert to the initial RAM configuration (the memory that came from the factory) and then I found that the problem still remains and booting does not work despite repeating the above described operations.
    Can adding RAM mess up the BIOS? A simple laptop upgrade that got complicated
    A quick web search quickly made me realise that I'm not the only one having this problem on this particular model of laptop:
    Can adding RAM mess up the BIOS? A simple laptop upgrade that got complicated
    It's exactly the same as mine! The laptop, colloquially speaking, has been "stoned" and now needs to be rescued. I decided on the "atomic" option, which is to upload a new BIOS with the CH341 programmer. This requires getting into the motherboard, i.e. you have to take the whole laptop apart.
    Can adding RAM mess up the BIOS? A simple laptop upgrade that got complicated
    The BIOS is in a tiny flash memory bone, here Winbond 25Q64FVSIG. the 64 in the name indicates the size - 64 megabits, or 8 megabytes. It needs to be programmed, but first also make a copy of it .
    Can adding RAM mess up the BIOS? A simple laptop upgrade that got complicated
    Such a memory is supposedly programmable on the chip, but in my experience this doesn't always work well, so I soldered the whole thing out with hot air and programmed it on a board-transfer from CH341. Of course the uploaded BIOS has to be preferably under the same version and revision of the motherboard as we have, plus it also contains the keys/OEM, so you either have to patch them yourself afterwards or resign yourself to losing them.... i was able to find a fit on the web for the upload candidate. Internet forums are a treasure mine though.
    Can adding RAM mess up the BIOS? A simple laptop upgrade that got complicated
    The laptop has started! The BIOS shows an older version. You can see the differences:
    Lenovo UEFI BIOS screen showing BIOS version, Intel Pentium 3550M, and 4096 MB installed memory
    Windows from the old drive boots immediately, so it is however it was indeed the BIOS that was at fault:
    Lenovo laptop with partially opened interior; Windows logo on screen with “Przygotowywanie urządzeń” text.
    However, the 8+8 version gives a blue screen of death, so in the end I opted for 8+4. 8+4 works in both combinations, so it's not like one of the new bones is faulty either.
    Windows blue screen error with restart message and QR code shown on a Lenovo laptop screen.
    The 4+8 version works fine. Also booting from USB now works. You can install your preferred operating system. There are not the problems that appeared before.

    In summary , the standard procedure for adding RAM to the laptop ended with an unexpected problem. The BIOS had to be reloaded. In my case this went without too much trouble, but I realise that not every person adding a RAM die has the equipment and skills to solder, so it could be an unpleasant surprise for someone else. Anyway, even a quick web search shows that the same thing has happened to other people - and on the same laptop.
    Now the laptop works and performs well as a station for browsing the internet, receiving emails and reading social media. It also does well with document editing and a printer.
    The process shown worked, although I wouldn't say it was fully complete as I didn't patch the new BIOS, the ME region was also left unchanged, but I have a backup of the original batch in case I need to. I may try to address these issues in a separate topic. Here the laptop has passed the tests and is running stable.
    Have you also already had such a "surprise" with the standard procedure for adding memory?

    Cool? Ranking DIY
    Helpful post? Buy me a coffee.
    About Author
    p.kaczmarek2
    Moderator Smart Home
    Offline 
    p.kaczmarek2 wrote 14199 posts with rating 12080, helped 645 times. Been with us since 2014 year.
  • ADVERTISEMENT
  • #2 21867848
    p.kaczmarek2
    Moderator Smart Home
    This surprised me too, as I've been swapping out some of these memories, and hadn't come across this before. So much good that flashing the BIOS is nothing new to me, so I was able to salvage quickly. But what would a person who doesn't know how to solder do? Especially if she doesn't own the laptop....
    Helpful post? Buy me a coffee.
  • ADVERTISEMENT
  • #3 21867854
    E8600
    Level 41  
    Here quite old hardware so bios without various security features like serial number, Windows key and other things that need to be transferred from old bios to new clean bios otherwise hardware won't boot. Observing repairs of modern laptops, where a significant part of laptop repairs consists of the secret art of crafting and winning the bios, one is discouraged from buying. In the past, you had to make an effort to damage the bios, but today bios can fail without user intervention.

    Nowadays it is no longer enough to be able to solder and use a programmer.
  • #4 21867877
    Mateusz_konstruktor
    Level 37  
    Let's take a closer look at the state of the connector of this RAM module (tick marks mine):
    Close-up of a SO-DIMM RAM module edge connector with gold contacts and a center notch.
  • ADVERTISEMENT
  • #5 21867881
    p.kaczmarek2
    Moderator Smart Home
    That's its own way, except that it's the old 4 GB RAM module what was there, not the new one, so that neither explains the "brick" nor the blue screens with the 8+8 combination.
    Helpful post? Buy me a coffee.
  • #6 21867891
    oscil1
    Level 23  
    And the "FN+R" key combination didn't do anything - because that's what it's there for.

    p.kaczmarek2 wrote:
    The 8+8 version, however, gives a blue screen of death, so in the end I opted for 8+4. 8+4 works in both combinations, so it's not like one of the new bones is defective either.


    That's not true - it's just that the faulty part may now be where Windows stores nothing, and that's why it hasn't died.
  • #7 21867898
    p.kaczmarek2
    Moderator Smart Home
    Fn+R didn't work for me, by the way, you have a screenshot from Reddit (first post) about that too. I was surprised myself, and at first I already thought I had damaged something with electrostatics (first time ever), but a quick web search showed that I wasn't the only one who had this situation.

    And if you have doubts about the RAM itself, the most reliable way to do it is with a memtest, although I tend not to run it on new ones from the shop.
    Helpful post? Buy me a coffee.
  • ADVERTISEMENT
  • #8 21867918
    gregor124
    Level 28  
    p.kaczmarek2 wrote:
    Today's interesting service story. Can swapping 4GB of RAM for 8GB damage a laptop so that it can no longer even boot or install the operating system? I have personally found out that it is possible

    No, it can't, as long as it's functional of course, a bug in the BIOS software can do it, for example.
    That's why I always recommend reading what the manufacturer has to say before making any changes, and certainly at least checking for BIOS updates.

    And what we have here. BIOS version 2.08 is available on the manufacturer's website as of 2018, which, among other things, introduces the fix
    VU#631788.
    In order not to bore you, I will write that this patch solves a problem with memory management by System Management Mode, this is a special mode used by, among other things, BIOS software, UEFI, etc.
    And the problem was that in some cases it could try to call routines in an area outside the physical RAM.
    Presumably if the latest version of the BIOS chip software, i.e. j7et63ww, 2.08, had been uploaded earlier, the problem would not have occurred.
    And, to prevent similar problems in the future, the latest available version, i.e. j7et63ww, 2.08, would have been uploaded

    https://pcsupport.lenovo.com/gb/en/products/l...-bit-64-bit-lenovo-b5400?category=BIOS%2FUEFI
    Helpful post? Buy me a coffee.
  • #9 21867930
    MichalMwp
    Level 11  
    The BIOS on laptops is modified every time the board is booted up so if the RAM doesn't work stably, you can crash the laptop even by firing up memtest on a flash drive.
    p.kaczmarek2 wrote:
    I was able to find a suitable upload candidate on the web

    This is where I would advise against this approach. As my colleague E8600 pointed out earlier, on new laptops this won't work. There's a lot of security, such as me-region (that's one of its primary functions), DMI, configurations in NVRAM, different bios for the same boards (HP and Acer excel at this). In addition, you can get into trouble and cause e.g. an End Point Security Error (in HP) which will write itself to KBC, or upload a bios with a Windows Autopilot licence, or upload a bios with an unconfigured me-region which will block the PCH or hybrid CPU permanently. On new boards, there are usually several memory cubes, plus a program in the KBC and signatures in the TPM. Really, it's not easy.
📢 Listen (AI):
ADVERTISEMENT