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Title: Installation & Consultation: 3-Phase Switchgear for 50m² Apartment - RCD, OMY Cable Queries

Todeo 32928 15
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Treść została przetłumaczona polish » english Zobacz oryginalną wersję tematu
  • #1 19039509
    Todeo
    Level 9  
    Hello,

    I'm moving to a new apartment and I'm going to do a little renovation :)
    The apartment is about 50 m² - 3 rooms. I found out that it is possible to connect a 3-phase installation to the apartment.
    I have made single-phase switchgears before, I even have some qualifications in this direction, but I wanted to consult colleagues who are up to date in the subject.

    I made a switchgear diagram. These are the things that concern me most of all
    1) RCD for induction - I met many posts / information from manufacturers that it is not required because the device will not be moved. If so, is it properly connected to the oven?
    2) I selected the RCD for the other circuits with a higher current due to the possible expansion with an additional "S".
    3) Have I missed something?
    4) I can't find information whether the OMY cable can be flush-mounted. Maybe someone could answer my question please.
    Title: Installation & Consultation: 3-Phase Switchgear for 50m² Apartment - RCD, OMY Cable Queries
    Regards
    Peter
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  • #2 19039549
    opornik7
    Electrician specialist
    Sorry buddy. It's not gonna happen.
    Quote:
    I even have some permissions in this direction

    :?:
    Why a four-pole disconnector?
    Surge arrester incorrectly connected. Can't see the markings on it?
    And this bigos. Cameras themselves, their descriptions themselves.
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  • #3 19039568
    kkas12
    Level 43  
    OMY under plaster, is it possible?
    You can, but why???
    And traditionally a four-track WG. What for?
    RCBO C16 followed by D20. What for?
    What are those D20s doing there anyway? They have no right to be there.
    So you can't arrange a separate circuit for the hob and a separate one for the oven?

    Generally meaningless stucco with no reflection in today's standards.
    Today, lighting circuits also require RCDs.
  • #4 19039664
    adwlodar
    Level 28  
    Todeo wrote:
    RCD for induction - I have seen many posts / information from manufacturers that it is not required because the device will not be moved. If so, is it properly connected to the oven?

    Referring to this point only, yes - RCD for permanently connected devices is not required, but the oven probably has a 1F standard with a plug, and it already requires an RCD +, as a rule, a device above 2kW, so separate circuits should be prepared.
  • #5 19040243
    Todeo
    Level 9  
    Title: Installation & Consultation: 3-Phase Switchgear for 50m² Apartment - RCD, OMY Cable Queries

    I can see that for users of the electrode, every detail matters. :)
    I know that the elements presented in the drawing are not a 1:1 reflection of the products that are in the plan, therefore the description next to it should explain what a given element is. Thank you to those who actually wanted to help and did not pick on the details of what is printed on a given element. :) Anyway, I looked for nice photos of the products I wanted on the internet and pasted them.
    The OMY cable is more flexible and fits better in the grooves, unlike the YDY cable. Nevertheless, I changed it to YDY since you recommend it.
    I also changed the lighting connection to the RCD.
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  • #6 19040268
    kkas12
    Level 43  
    What is the point of laying four wires to a cooker or induction hob???
    In some time you will buy a combined hob or a stove with an oven and wake up with your hand in the potty.
    Frugality, yes, but not miserliness based on myopia.

    The 4mm² in the board wiring is the same as the four wires in the board/cooker circuit.
    Electrical installation is not made-to-measure furniture!
    A little imagination and foresight.
    Todeo wrote:
    Thank you to those who actually wanted to help and did not pick on the details of what is printed on a given element.
    Really, don't make comments like that, because you're the one asking for help, but you're not the one dealing the cards. And besides, if you expect reliability from us, you should put in the work yourself.
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  • #7 19040337
    Topolski Mirosław
    Moderator of Electrical engineering
    opornik7 wrote:
    Surge arrester incorrectly connected. Can't see the markings on it?

    Still the same error.
    Todeo wrote:

    Title: Installation & Consultation: 3-Phase Switchgear for 50m² Apartment - RCD, OMY Cable Queries
    I can see that for users of the electrode, every detail matters.
    I know that the elements presented in the drawing are not a 1:1 reflection of the products that are in the plan, therefore the description next to it should explain what a given element is. Thank you to those who actually wanted to help and did not pick on the details of what is printed on a given element. Anyway, I looked for nice photos of the products I wanted on the internet and pasted them.
    The OMY cable is more flexible and fits better in the grooves, unlike the YDY cable. Nevertheless, I changed it to YDY since you recommend it.
    I also changed the lighting connection to the RCD.
  • #8 19041425
    Todeo
    Level 9  
    I improved the surge arrester and added a wire to the kitchen (5x4 mm² ;)
    Are the devices properly connected now?
    Title: Installation & Consultation: 3-Phase Switchgear for 50m² Apartment - RCD, OMY Cable Queries
  • #9 19041440
    sred
    Level 19  
    Type C everywhere? For what reason?
    32A for an induction hob, why?
  • #10 19041477
    Ktoś_tam
    Level 39  
    Third attempt and still glaring errors. Are you sure you can handle the assembly? Can you make more mistakes during assembly than in a drawing with a few lines? Remember that people still die from faulty installation. In Poland, it is said that there are many more deaths per million inhabitants than in the west. Well, no one here is playing electric. Are you aware that your actions are putting yourself and your family at risk?
    Do you make changes because you understand them, or do you change them because someone you don't know advised them to do so? If I tell you to change the oven cable to 3x4, will you change it or will you be able to defend what you have drawn at the moment?
    When you do something, especially if your life depends on it, you should understand what you are doing.
    Can you defend your change, for example from a 4-way switch to a 3-way switch? Did you change because a stranger, perhaps even a non-electrician, told you that you had it wrong.
    Do you understand the importance of individual cameras and what parameters they should have? Do you care?
  • #11 19041733
    opornik7
    Electrician specialist
    Ktoś_tam wrote:
    Third attempt and still glaring errors.

    Hey. It's getting better.

    Ktoś_tam wrote:
    Are you sure you can handle the assembly? Can you make more mistakes during assembly than in a drawing with a few lines?

    I see the biggest problem here.

    Back to the drawing. Induction power supply - 5x2.5 and S303/B16A protection are enough. For the protection of other circuits, it is better to use devices with B characteristics, unless you have a turbo vacuum cleaner ;)
    Signal lamps should be secured. Consider dividing the lighting into two circuits powered by different RCDs. I don't like your LGY 4 either.

    And now start the paper work on the construction of the switchgear. I'll give you a hint. Remember the PE bus, the common and separate N busbars, and the distribution block. Analyze the possibility of simultaneous operation of energy-intensive devices and that they are not on one phase of the WLZ.
  • #12 19041781
    artaa
    Level 43  
    No exaggeration with a turbo vacuum cleaner ;-)
    A flat of 50m², i.e. standard B16 and B10, plus RCCB (min 2 preferably A) or RCBO (if necessary) and min 6mm².
  • #13 19042824
    clubber84
    Level 37  
    I would give each room a separate circuit for sockets and a separate one for lighting (not as it is now - one protection for all sockets and one for all lighting), because if something "whacks", it will then be known which circuit has a "problem" .
    Unless a colleague wants (as in the diagram) to have one socket in each room, then one protection per circuit is enough.
  • #14 19042830
    adwlodar
    Level 28  
    clubber84 wrote:
    I would give each room a separate circuit for sockets and a separate one for lighting (not as it is now - one protection for all sockets and one for all lighting), because if something "whacks", it will then be known which circuit has a "problem" .

    I am not entirely convinced of the legitimacy of this solution in the apartment, especially since the layout of the houses is even very rarely used - each room separately.
    What I would definitely do is separate the bathroom lighting circuit as the "key" one for another RCD as advised resistor7 .
  • #15 19042841
    artaa
    Level 43  
    Separate in each room is unnecessary spending money, but if someone wants to do it can be done.
    Separate the bathroom, kitchen, as is the dishwasher, etc
    The rooms are overkill.
  • #16 19042941
    kkas12
    Level 43  
    And let him do even each socket in a separate circuit. His circus and his monkeys too.
    Only you should know, dear author of the thread, that performance is no longer the same as the >Copy-Paste< method.
    There is no room for nonchalance here.

    For me, however, the most sensitive receivers in the house are the fridge and freezer. Due to the content, it is good to protect them with separate RCBOs.

Topic summary

The discussion revolves around the installation of a 3-phase switchgear for a 50m² apartment, focusing on the necessity of RCDs for induction ovens, the use of OMY cables, and circuit configurations. Participants debate the requirement of RCDs for permanently connected devices, with some suggesting that separate circuits for high-power appliances like ovens and hobs are essential. Concerns are raised about the adequacy of the proposed circuit protection and the potential risks of improper installations. Recommendations include using B-type circuit breakers, separating circuits for different rooms, and ensuring proper grounding and busbar configurations. The conversation emphasizes the importance of understanding electrical installations to ensure safety and compliance with standards.
Summary generated by the language model.
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