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Reviews and experiences with the Fibaro Z-Wave smart home system

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What are the main real-world opinions on the Fibaro Z-Wave smart home system, especially for a new house?

Fibaro is generally viewed as a convenient, expandable wireless smart-home system that works well for retrofits and basic automation, but many users still prefer a wired system for a new build because they consider it more reliable and less prone to interference [#9979253][#9985433] One user who tested it said installing the modules was straightforward, but setting up scenes was the harder part; the controller software is configured over the network, so you don’t need to lay long control cables [#10691543] Another owner reported that the system was working well after a week and that the dimmers did not click audibly [#10701630] On the negative side, one HC2 user said customer support and remote access were unreliable and that remote access had still not been fixed after several weeks [#10496512] Supporters also stressed that Z-Wave devices act as repeaters in a mesh network, so routes are reconfigured if one path is disturbed [#9985433]
AI summary based on the discussion. May contain errors.
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  • #61 11379812
    _pirx_
    Level 2  
    Posts: 3
    You can always look into an alternative system, even if you don’t want to build it yourself using drivers ;) – this approach has recently become the most popular because it appears to be cheap. It wouldn’t be a bad idea to read up on the Vision system. I’ve got one of these little gems and I can’t complain. The system basically runs in the background once you’ve got used to the fact that there are certain things you don’t need to keep track of. And it has plenty of capabilities.
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  • #62 11526982
    Anonymous
    Anonymous  
  • #63 11531164
    cwan
    Level 13  
    Posts: 51
    Help: 7
    Rate: 4
    Hello,

    Do any of my esteemed colleagues know where I can buy or order the AeonLabs Z-Wave USB Stick at the cheapest price?
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  • #64 11536423
    andrefff
    Level 36  
    Posts: 2719
    Help: 321
    Rate: 807
    66 euros on eBay.
  • #65 11635765
    PiterW
    Level 11  
    Posts: 5
    Right, back to the topic. How can I connect this ‘rubbish’ :) to the Satel system, preferably wirelessly, even if it’s just to enable the on/off function? Because one simple option that springs to mind is using text messages and configuring responses to messages in the Satel control panel, but I’d be happy to hear other suggestions.

    After all, an option like the one below is a right nightmare. Is that the only solution?
    "..I don’t see any problem with integrating the FIBARO system with any alarm system.
    I’ve just had a SATEL system installed at my place and I’m currently connecting relays to two outputs on the control panel, with 2x1.5kW modules connected to the relays; this way, I’ll be able to view the alarm system status in FIBARO as follows:
    1) armed/disarmed
    2) ALARM / no alarm...”
  • #66 11636813
    richos
    Level 10  
    Posts: 5
    If you wish to control the Satel system, i.e. to arm or disarm it, you must connect to the CTL input (CA-6 control panel; for other models, please refer to the programming documentation) and programme this input accordingly using the FS125 function - option 6 – arming/disarming.
    Any Fibaro Switch can control the input, but the 2X1.5 is particularly useful as the load circuit can be powered by a different voltage to the Switch itself, which requires 220V.
    In Home Centre, set this switch as a “Control module” and it should work.
    I must admit I’ve only worked this out in theory so far, and I’ll be connecting it once I receive the RS232 cable I’ve ordered for programming the Satel from a PC, as I don’t want to fiddle about with the keypad.
    I’ll let you know how it all goes…
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  • #67 11639494
    PiterW
    Level 11  
    Posts: 5
    Wouldn’t it be better to connect that UNIVERSAL BINARY SENSOR of theirs inside the alarm housing?
  • #68 11640061
    richos
    Level 10  
    Posts: 5
    You can use the sensor on Satel’s outputs to check the alarm status, but you cannot use it to control the inputs. As the name suggests, it is just a sensor and its outputs simply reflect what is at the inputs.
    I should be connecting it up this week and will let you know how it works. I’ve already got the cable...
  • #69 11653435
    Anonymous
    Anonymous  
  • #70 11661075
    richos
    Level 10  
    Posts: 5
    I’ve just finished testing the connection with the Satel CA-6.
    Conclusions:
    1. It’s a shame I have so few outputs on the control panel :-( ; I’ve used both:
    - output 4 – standby indicator – to IN1 on the UBS
    - output 5 – input breach indicator – to IN2 on the UBS
    I connected them to the Fibaro UBS using 12V from the control panel – generally without any problems, but you need to reverse the polarity on output 5.
    In the Home Controller, you need to set IN1 to NO and IN2 to NC.

    2. You can control the CTL control input using the Fibaro Switch.
    There’s just one snag: CTL toggles standby on/off via a brief short to earth – whereas the Switch is either ON or OFF… You can, of course, set it to auto-off after, say, 1 second in the settings, but then it shows after a moment that the Switch is off.
    I’m still thinking about how to sort this out neatly without using additional relays or creating scenes. If I come up with something, I’ll let you know.
    3. Simply connecting the UBS gives me the ability to control scenes depending on the status of the detectors (whether they’re in standby or have detected an intrusion – even if they’re not armed).
    4. It’s not a plug-and-play solution, but someone with very basic knowledge of software and electronics can manage it :-)

    I’m curious about this new integration with Satel, but I suspect it will only be possible via ETHM, which means only the latest control panels and the extra cost of a network module. It will certainly make integration with Satel systems such as Integra much easier.
    I’d rather not install the beta version for the time being, as I don’t want to risk the whole system becoming unstable just yet. I’m particularly interested in its faster communication and the use of LUA...
  • #71 11661739
    Anonymous
    Anonymous  
  • #72 11666608
    richos
    Level 10  
    Posts: 5
    There is a solution using the CTL input, but it seems that this can only be done using scenes.
    You need to use one relay from the FGS221 as the ‘control’ relay in the alarm panel and, via two simple scenes (arm/disarm), activate the second relay for 1 second.
    It works well and you can fully control the alarm from a computer, iPhone or other scenes, or via the following associations: :-)
    Just be careful not to accidentally trigger that second relay, as the alarm will arm without warning…

    It turned out that it’s enough to do this on just one relay, setting the Auto Off parameter to 1 s, without any additional scenes...
  • #73 11672759
    didotom
    Level 16  
    Posts: 315
    Help: 7
    Rate: 21
    K.Kaminski wrote:
    I’d also like to ask for your opinion on the Fibaro system. I’m in the process of building a house and am seriously considering this solution. From what I understand, the system is wireless and can be controlled via a mobile phone or laptop, which I find very convenient. However, I’m also keen to save money, and the system has a feature for measuring gas and water consumption – a very useful function. What do you think about it?



    Instead, I suggest you simply run a twisted-pair cable to everything you want to control and monitor; that way, you’ll have more flexibility and can set up a similar system much more cheaply using a PCL controller, an Integra from Satel, or many others.

    For example, a 12V relay costs 12 zł and is powered from the control unit or a PCL controller.

    Added after 5 [minutes]:

    [quote]A new firmware update for Fibaro has been released. It supports Satel’s Integra via LAN

    Could you tell me what possibilities connecting Fibaro to Integra via ETHM1 will offer me?

    So far,
    I’ve set the roller shutter controls to run at specific times on the Integra, as well as the ability to control them from my phone via a handy menu on the macros.
    Control of watering, lighting, and simulating occupants at home.

    Admittedly, Integra doesn’t currently offer the ability to read temperature measurements, which is something I’m missing, although they’ve assured me they’re working on a mobile version of KPD HD, which, when combined with a certain module, will provide this capability.

    But I’d be keen to read about Fibaro’s integration with Integra and the benefits of combining both systems
  • #74 11673896
    richos
    Level 10  
    Posts: 5
    Here’s a good post showing how Fibaro can be integrated with Satel via the ETHM1.
    It’s a very interesting solution, but it only works with the latest control panels. Still, I’ll wait until the beta version becomes the final release.

    http://forum.fibaro.com/viewtopic.php?t=1155&...postorder=asc&highlight=beta&start=60

    As for Fibaro, first and foremost they have a more user-friendly interface on both PCs and smartphones, as well as support for Z-Wave and an ever-growing range of devices using that standard. What’s more, the latest version will support the Lua programming language, so you’ll be able to have a right go. And then there’s one more, the MOST IMPORTANT argument: my wife won’t agree to any extra cables, let alone drilling into the walls ;-)

    That said, for many applications, Integra on its own will probably be quite sufficient.
  • #75 11675566
    Anonymous
    Anonymous  
  • #76 11675752
    didotom
    Level 16  
    Posts: 315
    Help: 7
    Rate: 21
    Quote:
    didotom wrote:

    A new Fibaro firmware update has been released. It includes support for Satel integration via LAN


    Could you let me know what possibilities connecting Fibaro to the Satel system via ETHM1 will offer me?

    Perhaps you could start by familiarising yourself with the definition of a smart home
    http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inteligentny_dom

    Quote:


    But I’d love to read about the benefits of connecting Fibaro to Integra


    Integra doesn’t have:
    - dimmers
    - temperature measurement
    - it can’t control blinds.

    Neither system can control underfloor heating properly

    Do you want to control your underfloor heating? Do you have underfloor heating at home? Do you know how it works? What is the thermal inertia of the underfloor heating?

    For underfloor heating, you need a weather-compensated controller to control it properly; for this, Auratony thermostats are sufficient, as they shut off each circuit individually, but due to the thermal inertia, controlling underfloor heating doesn’t work very well, I wouldn’t buy those gadgets again when it comes to underfloor heating, and with the integration system I can also switch off each circuit once the set temperature is reached.
    So that argument doesn’t hold water, unless you’ve got something else in mind – please elaborate.


    It can control blinds, and does so excellently. Personally, I have NICE motors, and there was a problem with the control, but thanks to the essentially unlimited capabilities of the integrated system, I managed to sort it out.

    The problem was that control was only possible via a short circuit: that is, a short circuit opens the circuit for up to 3 seconds and closes it for over 10 seconds. Configuring these outputs on the Integr was no problem at all; in fact, the configuration options are virtually unlimited. As for automatic operation, they only work when the alarm is armed, and control via keypads, remote controls or a mobile phone is also no problem.

    Temperature control is fine; it’s not possible at the moment, but it will be soon – they’re working on it at Satel. As for dimmers, I’m not familiar with that, but I’m sure it’s also possible with the Integra.
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  • #77 11675818
    Anonymous
    Anonymous  
  • #78 11676055
    didotom
    Level 16  
    Posts: 315
    Help: 7
    Rate: 21
    This just goes to show that you’re completely clueless when it comes to underfloor heating. I get the impression that’s the case with other things too.

    You’re getting worked up for no reason; judging by your other comments, this happens to you quite often.



    Once I’ve set the heating, I don’t touch it at home, because there’s no need to turn the temperature down; once set, it works as it should. In homes with thermal mass walls, turning it down simply isn’t worth it for a few hours – just as it isn’t, for example, over a weekend when you’re away. when you return and want to raise the temperature by a few degrees, you’ll use so much energy that it certainly won’t be worth it; there’s simply no economic justification for it – though it’s a different matter in timber-framed houses.







    I’m not familiar with Fibaro; I’m just reading up on it and simply wondering what more this system would offer me compared to Integra alone. So far, apart from temperature readings, I can’t see anything I could use in my own system.




    [/quote]
    Yet another confirmation that you haven’t got the faintest idea about controlling blinds.
    [quote]

    What do you mean? Everything I need works: the user simulation on timers works, remote opening of roller blinds works, I can also open the garage door remotely; using macros in KPD2 Pro is very convenient and intuitive, and the system is currently being developed very intensively, as evidenced, amongst other things, by the software updates.



    How long am I supposed to wait? A year, two, or will they abandon the project because it’s pointless?
    Quote:





    PS.
    What’s the point of writing about the capabilities of an alarm system in a thread about the Fibaro wireless smart home system?



    My question was about the additional capabilities this system offers when combined with Integra – things you can’t do on Integra but can do on Fibaro.
    One of the lads above answered that, but you started getting unnecessarily worked up. The features I’m describing – which I use in Integra – work perfectly well, so what do you mean by ‘nonsense’?
  • #79 11676447
    Anonymous
    Anonymous  
  • #80 11676523
    didotom
    Level 16  
    Posts: 315
    Help: 7
    Rate: 21
    [/quote]
    Not the Integra, but the CA6. The difference between them is like that between a Trabant Limousine and an S8 limousine[/quote]


    I’m the only one writing about my Integra system – specifically the 64 model; the CA6 is a very simple alarm control panel, that’s a fact.


    I understand that you carry out installations like this; I don’t, although I still have plenty of ideas regarding the Integra 64. What’s more, you often see adverts for the Integra as ‘smart systems’; nevertheless, if this control unit’s capabilities prove insufficient, I might give Fibaro a go – I won’t deny it’s an interesting solution, but the Integra itself also offers plenty of possibilities, more than enough for many people.

    The key thing, though, is that it all has to be easy to use so that the family can manage it, ideally maintenance-free – and that’s what I’m gradually implementing in my own home. And apart from convenience, some savings would be welcome; and since it’s all wireless, it probably uses a bit of electricity too – I’m a fan of wired systems.
  • #81 11676826
    PiterW
    Level 11  
    Posts: 5
    Quote:
    Integration with the Satel alarm system


    Does anyone have any further details on whether communication is based on ethm-1 or ethm-2? I suspect it’s ethm-1, but I’m just curious.

    Another issue is connecting to the control panel via GPRS; the WRL128 can generally communicate with the outside world without ETHM, so why not make use of this option?

    Piotr
  • #82 11793354
    houk
    Level 11  
    Posts: 12
    Rate: 3
    Quote:

    You can use a Polish Sterbox to water your garden.


    I took a simpler approach. I used Polish Sterbox units and connected them to Z-Wave by writing my own plugin for the Vera hub. It works brilliantly; I can control around 64 lighting circuits, 12 sockets, 2 central heating pumps and 9 thermometers, and it cost me just 10 per cent of the price of a typical solution.

    Because, when you compare Fibaro and Vera, they’re essentially the same – it’s just that the folks at Micasa have made it possible to write your own plugins, including virtual devices that can be associated with TCP/IP network devices.
    The Vera Lite is only available on auction sites for 600 zł, and even so I had to go with Z-Wave because there’s no support for Fakro roller blinds in any other system.
  • #83 11821014
    Darek369
    Level 1  
    Posts: 1
    At Fibaro, only the marketing department is working properly. The rest isn’t functioning as it should. The HC2 hub can do a lot, but as it turned out after installation, it doesn’t have to do anything. Please message me for details; now is not the time for banter. If Fibaro’s specialists fail to get my third hub up and running, I’ll make it accessible remotely so anyone who wants to can see how sluggish the ‘Men’s Product of the Year’ really is . If anyone has an idea on how to tweak the control unit to make it work, please get in touch.
  • #84 11878303
    zenek1984
    Level 15  
    Posts: 184
    Help: 3
    Rate: 33
    Marketing of the lowest order. But how is it supposed to work properly when it’s not a large company but a network of branches where everyone’s pulling in their own direction? For example, in Wrocław, the man who runs the Fibaro branch spends his days installing these very devices, thereby competing with all the electricians they were so keen to encourage to sign contracts. What’s more, they don’t have their own electrician who could help out on the helpline if needed. But this state of affairs won’t last long because people aren’t idiots; before they buy anything, they do a lot of research and ask other users of the system. And as you can see, there are more and more negative reviews. Unfortunately, I used to have a very positive attitude towards the system, but the way I was treated has turned my attitude on its head.
  • #85 11916530
    grid33
    Level 13  
    Posts: 66
    Help: 3
    Rate: 8
    Sorry, but when you buy a car, do you also ask which way it drives and whether it turns when you reach a junction? Negative opinions about this or that product stem from the fact that when people come across a problem, they don’t try to solve it (their heads are 1.5 on their bums) they just go and vent on a forum and moan along with other users, and then they feel so united, all together against that nasty company that sold it to them, even though they didn’t want it in the first place. Anyway, I’ve been alive for 35 years but I’ve never come across a perfect product or service, just as there are no perfect people. I know one thing: to achieve 90 per cent customer satisfaction, you need time, support and committed users, customers, installers and distributors – regardless of whether it’s Fibaro or another Polish company.

    PS. I often ask questions myself on one forum or another, but this stems more from my own lack of knowledge than from wanting to badmouth something I don’t understand. Someone once told me that in the IT industry, problems usually lie between the keyboard and the chair....
  • #86 11916609
    kasprzyk
    Electrician specialist
    Posts: 5595
    Help: 354
    Rate: 671
    grid33 wrote:
    Sorry, but when you buy a car, do you also ask which way it drives and whether it turns when you reach a junction? Negative reviews about this or that product stem from the fact that when people come across a problem, they don’t try to solve it (their head’s 1.5 on their bum) but just go and have a moan on a forum and grumble along with other users, and then they feel so united, all against that nasty company that sold it to them, even though they didn’t want it in the first place. Anyway, I’ve been alive for 35 years but I’ve never come across a perfect product or service, just as there are no perfect people. I know one thing: to achieve 90 per cent customer satisfaction, you need time and support, as well as committed users, customers, installers and distributors – regardless of whether it’s Fibaro or another Polish company.

    PS. I often ask questions myself on one forum or another, but that’s more down to my own lack of knowledge than any desire to slag off what I don’t understand. Someone once told me that in the IT industry, problems usually lie between the keyboard and the chair....

    Mate, sorry, but your reply is off the mark. We don’t know the whole story, and we don’t know if the previous posts contain the truth, but the chap above isn’t ‘whingeing’ that something can’t be done – he’s simply made it clear what’s on his mind – he put it in these words: Unfortunately, I used to have a very positive attitude towards the system, but the way I was treated has turned my attitude on its head and this statement deserves a response.
    Regards
  • #87 11951525
    elektryk84
    Level 2  
    Posts: 2
    Hello.
    I’d advise anyone planning to buy a Fibaro HC2 control unit and install it in a commercial setting – rather than as a toy or gadget – to think it through carefully. I set up a heating control system for a client back in October, and despite numerous support enquiries, it still isn’t working properly. To keep things running more or less smoothly, you have to restart it every few hours. The control unit systematically loses communication with the switches every few hours.
    If anyone is interested in more details, please feel free to get in touch. I’d be happy to share my knowledge and tell you about the ineptitude of Fibaro’s support team.
  • #88 11965966
    sbromb
    Level 9  
    Posts: 5
    I’d also recommend a wired system, which is much safer and is sure to work reliably, without any faults. Farfisa has recently come up with a really clever smart solution for the home, launching its myLogic smart video monitors. They’re definitely worth a look.
  • #89 12045283
    kraks83
    Level 1  
    Posts: 1
    Hello. I’m starting to build a house in April and I’m thinking about installing a wired system. Could anyone recommend a reputable company or companies that specialise in this, preferably in the Silesia region? Thanks and best regards
  • #90 12099625
    kubai
    Level 14  
    Posts: 111
    Help: 9
    Rate: 8
    245292 wrote:
    An interesting article, though unfortunately it’s in English
    http://www.automatedhome.co.uk/reviews/fibaro-z-wave-home-center-2-mega-review.html

    PS
    kubai wrote:

    That is precisely why KNX isn’t actually such a good system . It is a system that is easy for typical electricians to get to grips with, and hence its widespread use in detached houses.

    Quote
    Quote:

    More than 11,000 KNX devices were used in the construction of Terminal 3 at Beijing Capital International Airport . They control the lighting, air-conditioning and heating systems , and transmit error messages.
    Beijing Airport’s Terminal 3, which boasts an area of 986,000 square metres, is the largest airport building in the world . It opened in February 2008.

    A nice detached house.

    KNX devices do not constitute a KNX system – as far as I’m aware, this airport uses Siemens’ Desigo system based on BACnet, so you’ve chosen a poor example, mate. KNX is only there because Siemens bought a company some time ago that manufactures such fan coil controllers specifically for KNX, and apparently it was cheaper for them to produce a gateway than to adapt those controllers to BACnet. Given the demands currently placed on building automation (integration with access control, intruder alarm systems, CCTV, A/V), RS-232 buses (which is what KNX is from an electrical engineering perspective) are a thing of the past – though that doesn’t mean they aren’t sufficient for small-scale installations (e.g. a detached house).
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