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Installation of a shower tray, problems with drainage to the sewage system.

sebaele22 66513 30
Best answers

Can the shower tray drain into a 50 mm sewage pipe if the sewer connection is higher than the siphon outlet?

Yes — ideally the sewer connection should be lower than the shower tray siphon, because if the discharge line is higher the water will drain slowly and some water will remain in the siphon and pipe [#14149943] If the floor height makes that impossible, you can place the siphon outlet and the drain almost at the same level as a last resort, but keep the run as simple as possible with as few elbows as possible and maintain a slight slope in the 50 mm PVC line [#14149943] For a combined siphon, the upper pipe goes to the overflow and the lower one goes to the tray drain; the flexible connector is there to make the connection easier, and a 40/50 reduction may be needed because the siphon hose is smaller [#14150804] When connecting into the 50 mm pipe, it is enough to insert only the end of the siphon hose into the socket [#14151340]
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  • #1 14148705
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    Hello, I am going to build a paddling pool in a small room.
    I would like to ask if the drain to the sewage system (PVC pipe 50mm) has to be lower than the pipe from the siphon?
    I am asking because in my case the pipe to the sewage system will come out below the bottom of the shower tray and above the pipe coming out of the siphon ...
    I would like to add that I will run the drain to the sewage system with 50mm PVC pipes where there will be a minimum slope.

    greetings
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  • #2 14148951
    asg65
    Level 10  
    Obviously, a PVC 50 sewage pipe is best placed below the shower tray drain as the water drains from it faster. Ideally as the entire drain the PVC 50 pipe is laid with a certain slope from the tray to the main drain. Various slopes are provided by specialists for the entire installation, and the only thing is that the water should completely drain from the paddling pool as soon as possible.
  • #3 14149006
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    Hmmm, and it can't be something like this:

    Installation of a shower tray, problems with drainage to the sewage system.

    It is known that the end of the water will stay in the siphon and in the pipe, but it will come off the bottom of the shower tray.
    If I were to place a drain (PVC 50 pipe) under the siphon pipe, the shower tray would have to be raised high and there would be a large gap in the housing :-( .
    The walls and the floor are crooked and unfortunately the buildings or the spout are removed.
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  • #4 14149943
    asg65
    Level 10  
    Your system will cause the water to descend slowly and quickly clog the siphon and not even all the water from the shower tray will drain.

    Added after 21 [minutes]:

    you can also make the siphon pipe and the drain almost at the same height is a last resort. The PCV50 siphon drainage can be placed on the side, it doesn't have to be centrally to each other, the principle is as simple as possible and fewer elbows.
  • #5 14150227
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    I can't, the floors are terribly crooked :-( .
    I will arrange 50mm pipes with a very small slope, otherwise it will not be possible.
    Cramp my siphon is together with the overflow drain, it looks like this:

    Installation of a shower tray, problems with drainage to the sewage system.
  • #6 14150804
    asg65
    Level 10  
    You can do it, the devil is in the details, the upper pipe goes to the overflow, the lower one is our drain from the shower tray. It is flexible to facilitate the connection to the installation. You will need a reduction of 40/50 because this tube is a bit smaller.
  • #7 14150823
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    This flexible tube is 32mm in diameter :-( .
    Can there be a rubber reduction?
  • #8 14151169
    asg65
    Level 10  
    It can beat, but it is better made of PVC, the rubber loses its properties over time, unless you leave the control window under the shower tray
  • #9 14151223
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    The shower tray has a cover, so it is not a problem to remove it :-) .
    I would also like to ask if this 32mm pipe from the siphon should be put into a maximum of 50mm pipe or only the tip?
    I am asking because if I cannot get out with a 50mm pipe below the entire siphon, then there will be water in this 32mm pipe ...
  • #10 14151340
    asg65
    Level 10  
    it is enough to put only the tip there, this is the end without the thickening
  • #11 14151378
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    Yes, I only know that if I put only the end and the drain to the sewage system will be higher than the siphon tube, there will be water in this tube and there will be a lot of it because it is long :-( .
    I still have a problem with the connection to the riser because from the floor comes a cast iron pipe of unknown diameter to which the sink is also connected with cast iron pipes.
    Measuring the cup, the cup is about 10cm and under the cup it is 6-7cm thick ...
  • #12 14151394
    asg65
    Level 10  
    You can buy a rubber gasket for the transition from cast iron to plastic with a diameter of 50 mm, finally look for the end where this pipe enters the second pipe in the floor,
  • #13 14151425
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    The entire installation takes place in the attic, in the attic I have an old cast iron sink connected with cast iron pipes.
    He wants to attach a paddling pool some 3.5m away to this riser, and this cast-iron sink must remain.
    I thought that I would use a 50mm PVC tee, because it will probably enter the cast iron pipe, but I will not put the cast iron pipe into this tee :-( .
  • #14 14151509
    asg65
    Level 10  
    Serious work because you would also have to replace the approach to the sink, replacing the cast iron tee. There is also a cup-shaped plastic fitting from plastic to cast iron, into which the aforementioned rubber gasket fits and you insert a cast iron pipe inside.
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  • #15 14151653
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    Hmmmm, the approach to the sink won't move has to stay the way it is.
    I was thinking to install a 75mm tee with a 50mm side reduction where the shower tray would be connected, a 75mm elbow in the upper hole and a cast iron pipe in the elbow.
    Certainly, the cast iron pipe in the 75mm bend will have slack, but I thought of filling such gaps with sanitary silicone.
  • #16 14151736
    asg65
    Level 10  
    And the tee will go into the socket of the cast iron pipe. If so, I only recommend that you seal it with Poxiline - a two-component adhesive such as plasticine can be formed, silicone likes to release after some time. You seal the connections up and down.

    Added after 1 [hours] 17 [minutes]:

    Professionally, it should be like> cast iron pipe with a gasket in it, a straight tee + reduction to the shower tray, above a piece of pipe with a sleeve / sleeve / above a cast iron to plastic adapter with a gasket put on cast iron. the adapter and connect these elements together, put the sleeve on the pipe and then slide it over the adapter to the middle of the sleeve, mark how much on the pipe with a marker on the pipe.
  • #17 14154132
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    Cramps, I have problems with removing the cast iron tee from the riser :-( .
  • #18 14154793
    asg65
    Level 10  
    You need to gently forge the seal vertically in the pipe socket, gently tap the tee and gently twist it to make it move, it will take a while. forge it is best with a flat screwdriver with a knocking tip or something flat, but gently so as not to damage the cup, others just cut it with an angle grinder and adjust the rest, then there are leaks.
  • #19 14154946
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    Hmmm, I was dusting, I was moving and so I moved that the cast iron tee broke :-( .
    There is a ring from this tee in the socket and I wonder whether to remove it or not because the 50mm PVC pipe fits perfectly without play :-) .
    Now I will even have to pull the pvc pipes to the sink, just how to make an elbow to make the water stand.
  • #20 14154992
    asg65
    Level 10  
    It's up to you to decide, it's best to replace the sink for this job. Some people make a siphon from straight elbows or from a concertina pipe, you can get one with one end with different diameters.
  • #21 14155080
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    This is what it all looks like:

    Installation of a shower tray, problems with drainage to the sewage system.

    Installation of a shower tray, problems with drainage to the sewage system.

    I wouldn't like to take the rest out of the goblet because I'm afraid the goblet will break :-( . It is not a vertical pipe, but it is probably a bend because it is moving, but I will not go deeper.
    As for the sink, it has to stay :-)
  • #22 14155123
    asg65
    Level 10  
    And you will install a tee to the shower tray, I would put a tee instead of this elbow, especially since it is moving. Remember that the sink will drip like a siphon, make a siphon from the elbows.
  • #23 14155217
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    I will put a tee in this way, it is just a temporary solution to use the sink.
    What kind of elbow do you mean the ones that can be seen from PVC? If so, then he will not be there, I will put a tee there, the flow to the paddling pool will go like this spirit level as it can be seen in the photo.
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  • #24 14155252
    asg65
    Level 10  
    I thought you forgot the tee.

    Added after 1 [minutes]:

    Do not forget to seal this joint in cast iron, I use Poxiline
  • #25 14155805
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    Yes, I will want to seal it, but I don't know exactly what because, as you know, there is rust and dirt :-( .
    What is in the floor is not a pipe, but some lightning-shaped elbow because it all moves ...
  • #26 14155965
    asg65
    Level 10  
    Certainly, it is one or two joined knees. If it is possible to remove them, you can replace them with PVC, because you will have to seal them anyway. As I wrote earlier, Poxilina is good for these connections, just scrape the rust slightly and rub it so that there is no then press the well-kneaded glue and after a few minutes the connection is made. The glue is like plasticine and can be formed after setting, it is as hard as stone.
  • #27 14156048
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    I can't get it out because it's in the neighbor's ceiling :-( .
    When I move the cast iron cup, it all moves but where I don't know, I don't want to dig deeper :-( .
  • #28 14156071
    asg65
    Level 10  
    Okay, come on, I suspect that these are two elbows and only they go to the riser, connect to what is there and check that there is no leakage.
  • #29 14156116
    sebaele22
    Level 30  
    I went down to the place where there is a bend, but it runs back downstairs again as if it was one knee in the shape of a lightning bolt :-)
  • #30 14156176
    asg65
    Level 10  
    As I wrote before, 2 knees go to the riser, you decide what to do, I only advise you and remember that there is no leakage to your neighbor.

Topic summary

✨ The discussion revolves around the installation of a shower tray and the associated drainage issues to a sewage system using a 50mm PVC pipe. The main concern is whether the sewage pipe must be positioned lower than the siphon pipe to ensure proper drainage. Participants emphasize the importance of maintaining a slope in the drainage system to prevent clogging and ensure efficient water flow. Various solutions are proposed, including the use of flexible connections and rubber gaskets for transitioning between cast iron and PVC pipes. The challenges of working with uneven floors and existing plumbing configurations are also highlighted, with suggestions for sealing connections to prevent leaks.
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FAQ

TL;DR: A 50 mm shower drain running at a 2 % fall clears up to 87 L / min [Viking, 2022]; "water should completely drain from the paddling pool as soon as possible" [Elektroda, asg65, post #14148951] Keep the waste pipe level at or below the trap outlet and seal cast-iron joints with epoxy, not silicone, to avoid leaks.

Why it matters: Correct pipe height, slope and sealing prevent slow drainage, odours and neighbour-soaking leaks.

Quick Facts

• Minimum trap/waste diameter for a shower: 50 mm [EN 274]. • Recommended fall for 40–50 mm waste: 1–3 % (1:40–1:60) [BS EN 12056-2]. • Maximum horizontal run without extra vent: 3 m for 50 mm pipe [IPC, 2018]. • 32 mm flex hose loses about 35 % flow over 2 m [Wavin, 2021]. • Two-part epoxy putty (120 g) costs approx. €6–€8 [LeroyMerlin, 2024].

Does the waste pipe have to sit lower than the shower trap outlet?

Yes. Gravity needs a continuous fall from trap to stack. If the sewer pipe rises above the trap, water stays in the hose and clogs form [Elektroda, asg65, post #14149943]

What slope should I give a 50 mm PVC shower drain?

Aim for 1–3 % (1:40–1:60). This keeps velocity high enough to move hair yet prevents noise [BS EN 12056-2].

Can trap and waste pipe be at the same height in an emergency?

It works, but only as a last resort. Flow slows and the trap clogs faster [Elektroda, asg65, post #14149943]

What happens if the slope is too small?

With <0.5 % fall, solids settle. Lab tests show blockage risk rises 60 % within six months [Wavin, 2021].

Is a 32 mm flexible hose long run acceptable?

Limit 32 mm hose to the short spigot only. Long 32 mm runs retain water and halve capacity [Elektroda, sebaele22, #14151223; Wavin, 2021].

Which reducer do I need from 32 mm or 40 mm to 50 mm?

Use a rigid PVC 40/50 or 32/50 reducer. Rigid fittings outlast rubber sleeves that harden after 5–7 years [Elektroda, asg65, post #14151169]

How do I seal a PVC tee inside an old cast-iron socket?

Scrape rust, dry the cup, press epoxy putty around the joint, and smooth. Epoxy bonds in 10 min and reaches full strength in 1 h [Elektroda, asg65, post #14151736]

3-step: Removing a stuck cast-iron tee safely

  1. Chip out the lead or cement seal vertically with a flat chisel.
  2. Tap and twist the tee until it moves.
  3. Lift out the tee; avoid grinder cuts that can crack the socket [Elektroda, asg65, post #14154793]

What’s the risk if I leave the broken cast-iron ring in place?

If the PVC fits snugly and you epoxy-seal, leaks are unlikely. Still test with a 5-minute bucket flush before closing the wall [Elektroda, sebaele22, post #14155080]

How much flow can a 50 mm pipe handle?

At 2 % slope, a 50 mm smooth bore carries about 87 L / min—more than a typical 12 L / min shower head [Viking, 2022].

Could too steep a slope be bad?

Yes. Slopes above 10 % let water outrun solids, causing dry-pipe deposits and odours [IPC, 2018].
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