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Smart thermostat system for 5 rooms with Satel 128 Plus, Salus IT500, IT300 integration

ewenement22 1104 9
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  • #1 17686890
    ewenement22
    Level 21  
    Hello
    I am looking for a solution that, at no great cost, will allow me to manage online the temperature in 5 rooms in my house.
    I currently have a satel 128 plus integrator , a salusa it500 thermostat and a salusa it300 wireless sensor , and of course a salusa shortage to have online access. Unfortunately it500 is only able to operate 2 zones.... At my place it is the ground floor and the 1st floor. Downstairs I have underfloor heating and on each loop I already have a salusa valve controlled by 230v (this will allow me in the future to extend the system with online selection thanks to e.g. integra which loop is to be heated, I only need a couple of relays and from 1-2 hours of my work ;) ) . I have 9 radiators upstairs and underfloor heating in the bathroom. If I had a raki manifold upstairs like I have for the underfloor heating system downstairs I would also fit actuators there for about 50 zł salus and I wouldn't have to buy electro-valves for about 150 zł for each radiator or floor circuit. I'm already thinking about replacing the manifold upstairs with the one I have downstairs for the floor. Cheaper than buying 9 solenoid valves now.
    Unfortunately, since the it500 only covers 2 zones, I guess I will have to sell it and look for 5 inexpensive thermostats that can be operated online in a fairly convenient way. I have a Termet Ecocondens gold plus 25.kW boiler with 10x modulation. I am in the process of checking how much the cooker burns for me per hour when heating the whole house at 60 degrees . When I have a moment I will check how much it burns at 55 degrees, how much at 50 .... how much on 54 and how much on 40:) less I don't think there is anything to set because the radiators would have to heat up half a day before they would heat up in the rooms upstairs:) Any advice welcome.... I'm green on the subject:)
    Do you know of any thermostats that can be managed online and are not particularly expensive? They could give a signal to the Integra and the integra would open the solenoid valves or actuators.
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  • #2 17689423
    ewenement22
    Level 21  
    Anyone have any suggestions? I would be grateful
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  • #3 17738415
    Plumpi
    Heating systems specialist  
    Why so impatient? Do you think there are duty officers sitting on the forum whose duty it is to give advice? :) .

    You write that it is supposed to be inexpensive. How much is inexpensive to you?

    A very cool piece of equipment is the Honeywell Evohome
    The HCC80R strip supports 5 and with an additional extension 8 heating zones.
    You can use wireless thermostats or room temperature sensors to control the strip: CM927 , DTS92 , HCW82 , HCF82
    You can integrate and manage the entire system with the ATC928G3026 panel
    This panel allows the management of up to 12 heating zones + DHW and management via the internet from a computer or smartphone.
    Here you have the shop https://sklep.domkomfort.com.pl/47-inteligentne-ogrzewanie
    You can judge for yourself whether expensive or cheap.
    A great advantage of the above set is the possibility of integrating the above control with the home automation system Tahoma Somfy and the Domoticz software using the HGI80 module.


    Another solution, slightly cheaper but also poorer, may be a set of the Polish company Tech, e.g. wireless skirting board L-8 https://www.techsterowniki.pl/p/l-8 or other wired skirting boards.
    The L-8 skirting board, together with the M-8 panel and the St-507 or WiFi RS internet connection + a set of room sensors or controllers, makes it possible to create up to 8 heating zones.

    Unfortunately you do not write anything whether you have any wiring.
    If you do have it or you can make it, an interesting solution may be the PLC2011
    https://elkom.com.tw/pl/2014/10/05/plc2011c1-inteligentny-dom-sterownik-plc/
    Unfortunately it is not very easy to configure and requires more commitment than the above mentioned Honeywell or Tech systems. But it is also much cheaper.

    The Integra control panel itself allows you to create probably 2 heating system thermostats, plus management via the internet or GSM, but personally I would advise against it.
  • #4 17744674
    ewenement22
    Level 21  
    Plumpi wrote:
    The Integra control panel itself allows for the creation of perhaps 2 heating system thermostats, plus management via the internet or GSM, but personally I would advise against it.

    why
  • #5 17751477
    Plumpi
    Heating systems specialist  
    Dedicated systems are easier to operate. They have functions which are more difficult or even impossible to obtain in a control panel, e.g. a function which, based on the dynamics of heating or cooling, is able to control the heating in advance in order to achieve the desired temperature at a given time.
    If the control panel fails, there are more problems, because you have to buy a new one and program it the same way. Often, after some time, it turns out that you need to buy a slightly larger control unit or a different model with additional functions, and then the problem begins, because you have to reprogram the new unit from scratch. The old program with settings cannot always be uploaded to newer versions of the control panels, let alone to newer models.
    When replacing a dedicated controller, usually the newer versions are compatible with older components, and the replacement itself takes several minutes.
    Configuration is easy and straightforward even for non-technical people. To program a control panel you already need to have some idea. Assuming you have them... what happens if repairs need to be made when you are not at home? Will the family be sitting in a cold house? Will you still remember the passwords to the control panel configuration software and configuration files after a few years? Will you remember where the configuration files are located?
    Dedicated automation is more likely to be handled by any savvy installer whom the family can invite to repair the control.
    Furthermore, making the control of an alarm system available on the internet is quite a treat for hackers.
    If someone breaks into the heating controls, the most they can do is mess up the heating settings. If the alarm system is hacked into, there is no telling what the outcome could be. Possibly even breaking into a house, because, as they say, "opportunity makes the thief".
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  • #6 17751526
    kood
    CCTV and Stationary Alarms specialist  
    Plumpi wrote:
    Will you still remember the passwords to the control panel configuration program and configuration files after a few years? Will you remember where the configuration files are located? bbfca94bf

    Is that a problem? One file where passwords etc are stored. Artificially creating problems that don't exist.

    Plumpi wrote:
    Also making the control of the alarm system available on the internet is quite a treat for hackers.
    If someone breaks into the heating controls, they will at most mess up our heating settings. If the alarm system is hacked into, there is no telling what the outcome could be. Possibly even breaking into a house, because as they say "opportunity makes the thief".bbfca94bf

    Can a colleague provide any sources for these revelations?
    Some example of an incident where a hacker disarmed a system over the internet and then robbed the facility.
  • #7 17751845
    Plumpi
    Heating systems specialist  
    kood wrote:
    Plumpi wrote:
    Will you still remember the passwords to the control panel configuration program and configuration files after a few years? Will you remember where the configuration files are located?


    Is that a problem? One file where passwords etc are stored. Artificially creating problems that don't exist.

    Plumpi wrote:
    Also making the control of the alarm system available on the internet is quite a treat for hackers.
    If someone breaks into the heating controls, they will at most mess up our heating settings. If the alarm system is hacked into, there is no telling what the outcome could be. Possibly even breaking into a house, because as they say "opportunity makes the thief".


    Can a colleague provide some sources for these revelations?
    Some example of an incident where a hacker disarmed a system over the internet and then robbed the property.


    I don't understand why the aggression?
    As for passwords, I know from personal experience that I can't remember passwords for systems I used to run. If it wasn't for the fact that I started writing them down in a notebook, scrupulously hidden, then for many of these systems the configuration files I kept would be completely useless.

    Now the question of security.
    Are you able to prove and assure me that such an intrusion is not possible?
    Are you able to assure me that the notebook with the stored passwords will not be lost?
    Are you able to assure me that the laptop with which you configure the control panels will not be lost?
    Are you able to assure me that nobody can read the hidden password for the configuration programme?
    Are you sure that your laptop is 100% clean and no one has installed a keylogger in it?

    Maybe I would believe you if I had never used programs that read such passwords myself and didn't know how a computer could be hacked.

    Maybe you're a specialist in alarm systems, I'm not. Although I was in business for a dozen years installing such systems.
    But I know enough about where the weaknesses of such systems are to state unequivocally that there are no 100% secure systems.

    Best regards and have a good day.
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  • #8 17751928
    kood
    CCTV and Stationary Alarms specialist  
    Plumpi wrote:
    I don't understand why the aggression?
    As for passwords, I know from personal experience that I can't remember passwords for systems I used to run. If it wasn't for the fact that I started writing them down in a notebook, scrupulously hidden, then for many of these systems the configuration files I kept would be completely useless.
    .

    In the system you are talking about (Integra) even the fact that you know the service password is not enough to allow you to do anything with the system, besides, the manufacturer allows service entry into the system (unless the installer blocks it).

    Plumpi wrote:
    Maybe I would believe you if I had never used programs that read such passwords myself and didn't know how to break into a computer.


    I can give you my laptop and I'd be happy to see you crack passwords and get into DloadX break more passwords and then get into the control panel configuration, only even once you've got through that and set up access to the control panel on your phone via ETHM you still need the same user/administrator password to do anything as you did when you entered the house on the keypad.

    Plumpi wrote:
    to state unequivocally that there are no 100% secure systems.
    .

    Sure they don't exist, except that the likelihood of someone breaking security via an internet module and breaking into someone's house as you suggest is similar to someone using your dedicated heating system to do such a break-in or remotely burning down someone's house.
  • #9 17752084
    Plumpi
    Heating systems specialist  
    You are looking from the level of the system installer, forgetting that in the case of the author of the thread, he will be the installer, administrator and user in one person.
    In his case, his Achilles' heel may just be the "One file where passwords etc. are stored" .

    I too have assisted clients remotely on many occasions, but I have always configured the system so that I have no way of changing anything without the client's permission and physical assistance. I simply never knew the administrator and user passwords.
    Unfortunately, there were times when clients didn't change their factory passwords, or made up passwords that a child would have guessed.
    I installed an access system in a certain company for, among other things, the server room, a room that is quite strategically important.
    The RFID + code system did not go through because it was too expensive, and it was decided that there was no need for it. The code alone remained.
    After some time, I received a notification to come and do something about it, because there was a suspicion of unauthorised access to the server room. My hands fell off as I looked at the keypad and on the second or third attempt I hit the code.
  • #10 17752216
    kood
    CCTV and Stationary Alarms specialist  
    Plumpi wrote:
    You are looking from the level of the system installer, forgetting that in the case of the author of the thread he will be the installer, administrator and user in one person.
    In his case, his Achilles' heel may just be the "One file where passwords etc are stored".
    .

    I repeat again, in Integra the service password is not enough to change anything in the system, and if the user allows his password to leak there is no need to hack anything, just approach the keypad.

    Plumpi wrote:
    Unfortunately there have been times when customers have not changed their factory passwords,
    .

    Because you were doing it wrong, it is you as the installer who should change the factory passwords, give them to the customer and train them how to change them and warn them against setting 1234.

    I don't know why you perceive this as an attack on you personally, I'm just asking you not to sow alarm in our current and future customers because this forum indexes quite high in search engines.
    Well unless such cases actually happen that alarm systems connected to the internet are hacked then please provide a source as I would love to know because I have not heard of such a case yet.
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Topic summary

The discussion focuses on managing online temperature control for five rooms using existing equipment including the Satel 128 Plus integrator, Salus IT500 thermostat, and Salus IT300 wireless sensor. The IT500 supports only two zones, covering the ground and first floors, with underfloor heating downstairs and multiple radiators upstairs. The user considers expanding control by adding relays to select heating loops via the Integra system and contemplates installing a RAKI manifold with Salus actuators upstairs to avoid costly electro-valves for each radiator. Responses suggest alternative solutions such as the Honeywell Evohome system with HCC80R strip supporting 5 to 8 zones, wireless thermostats (CM927, DTS92, HCW82, HCF82), and integration with ATC928G3026 panel for internet management and compatibility with home automation platforms like Tahoma Somfy and Domoticz via HGI80 module. The discussion also covers the advantages of dedicated heating control systems over integrator panels, emphasizing ease of use, advanced functions like predictive heating based on temperature dynamics, and compatibility with older components. Security concerns about internet access to control panels are debated, highlighting that service passwords alone do not grant full system control and stressing the importance of proper password management and physical security. The Integra system’s layered security model is noted, where remote access requires multiple authentication steps, reducing hacking risks. Overall, the conversation balances cost-effective expansion of heating zones with system complexity, integration capabilities, and security considerations.
Summary generated by the language model.
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