Standards regulating the connection of wire colors to pins in molded plugs

szarikmisza wrote:

This is probably a conventional rule. This rule is not followed by manufacturers of heating boilers and electric cookers, which require a service technician/installer with appropriate qualifications to properly install the plug on the cables, i.e. the phase cable where there is actually a phase, etc.

Yeah. And the customer/owner will move the plug to the neighboring socket (because there may be one nearby) and the entire elaborate plan of the boiler manufacturer and its service technician will be ruined.

It depends on the client/owner. If he can think, he won't do such tricks, if he can't, maybe the wasted time and possible hit in the pocket will teach him something.

szarikmisza wrote:

It depends on the client/owner. If he can think, he won't do such tricks, if he can't, maybe the wasted time and possible hit in the pocket will teach him something.

What will it teach him? That the "producer" made a mistake? No exaggeration!

After all, putting a plug on the cables ruins everything. Except for PEN. Those responsible for ovens or induction hobs, which are connected to terminals without plugs, have the right not to accept complaints.

Not necessarily the manufacturer, maybe the installer, if the boiler socket has a phase on a different side than the rest.

szarikmisza wrote:

Not necessarily the manufacturer, maybe the installer, if the boiler socket has a phase on a different side than the rest.

This does not change the fact that we are still dealing with a dud.
And if the "manufacturer" requires polarization of the cable connected to the boiler, let his service technician connect it permanently. There will be no speculation whether the phase is on the right side or not.
PS. Indicate the regulation that states on which side the phase/N should be located in the socket.

szarikmisza wrote:

It depends on the client/owner. If he can think, he won't do such tricks, if he can't, maybe the wasted time and possible hit in the pocket will teach him something.

And maybe someone will teach you that if the device is not factory equipped with a plug, then it should not be installed. Such a device should then be permanently connected. The fact that installers take shortcuts and install plugs because there is a socket nearby is another story. Permanent connection requires more work, so either the profit is lower or the service is more expensive and you can say goodbye to the order, because someone will always come along who will do it cheaper and faster, not necessarily well.
When it comes to the customer's approach, I suspect that 100% of non-electricians and the like do not wonder where N is and where L is.

Ktoś_tam wrote:

(...) The fact that installers take shortcuts and install plugs because there is a socket nearby is another story. (...)

I wouldn't call such a progressive person a fitter.
Even if someone makes these connections themselves, they do it on a strip, not like the above-mentioned "installer".

Ktoś_tam wrote:

When it comes to the customer's approach, I suspect that 100% of non-electricians and the like do not wonder where N is and where L is.

Because most people do not have obsessive-compulsive disorder, which causes, among other things, the following behavior: it must be like this , because if it is different, the end of the world, the EU and other sentient beings will occur.

Don't write nonsense about any rules. Even contractual ones. Because there is no such thing.
A device connected via a socket and plug must not be sensitive to the polarity of the socket.
At least in a country where there is no provision requiring the phase to be on this or that side of the socket.

I did the installation at my brother-in-law's. For the oven, a circuit from the third phase of the induction cable. It was supposed to be in the box permanently, because ovens don't have plugs, only wires connected to the terminal. Furniture assemblers also installed household appliances. Canned induction, and my brother-in-law bought a new Bosch oven with a plug. So the guys plugged it into the socket along with the fridge. Fortunately, there was no extension cord because the cable and the double socket (two next to each other) were enough. The effect is that when the oven is operating, e.g. my sister-in-law will set it to 200° and while the oven is heating up, she will reduce the temperature using the knob, the thermostat will disconnect and the differential will be dropped. If it turns off by itself after warming up, nothing happens. Such a prank. After changing the phase in the socket, the situation normalized. I thought that devices with a plug are insensitive to which pin is the phase. I'll be at his place during the May weekend and I'll take a look at it because that's how we manage it remotely. There was even an idea to cut off the plug, but I'm afraid of the warranty.

There is an informal standard for the CEE 7/7 plug that was supposed to be universally applicable throughout Europe, but has not been officially adopted due to a lack of agreement among CENELEC delegates. Several countries did not support this. This non-existent but existing "Euro plug" has the markings L and N next to the pins on the plug in such a way that L is next to the pin that connects to the right contact of the socket. I have two devices with such a plug at home. One has a UPS power supply, the other is from the computer. I also saw a portable induction cooker in some store and it was equally polarized. As for the UPS, connecting it to a socket with the phase on the left triggers the RCD. It's a photo plug.

The plugin is common in Western Europe, especially in France, Belgium, Spain, as well as in Russia and Ukraine. UPS came to me from Germany, so I guess they use them too Added after 10 [minutes]:

BANANvanDYK wrote:

Meanwhile, in a neighboring country it is:

What should the manufacturer of the cable with plug do to ensure that the product meets ALL European standards?

pla20 wrote:

There is an unwritten rule that in sockets the phase should be on the left and 0 on the right.

The theory is wrong. The standards of all other countries that accept sockets as polarized refer to the phase contact on the RIGHT side.
But in Poland, sockets are considered unpolarized, which is why there are double sockets in which the polarity is reversed.

Once, on some international forum about European sockets, someone posted a link with socket diagrams, and it turns out that there are probably some standards in the world, or at least something like typical polarization for a given type of socket: https://upload.wikimedia.org/ wikipedia/commons/3/37/Types_AC_power_sockets%2C_standard_polarity%2C_wiring%2C_voltage%2C_current.jpg

Added after 23 [minutes]:

misiek1111 wrote:

kkas12 wrote:

Of the approximately 20 wires I cut from various devices, all of them had the colors connected as in the photo, including those manufactured by Legrand.
I understand that there is no such standard in Poland. Maybe there is a standard in the PRC and hence the uniformity.

Legrand is French, and France has standardization for all CEE sockets where the pin order is clockwise. In the case of industrial connectors it is like everywhere, but in a socket with the pin turned upside down, the phase is on the right side according to this order and it is included in the NF C 15-100 standard. It's the same in Belgium.
Recently, an interesting material appeared on YT "why do we have a phase on the left in the socket and others have it on the right" on the occasion of a review of the socket tester https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXhBn1mM3w8

Added after 56 [minutes]:

BANANvanDYK wrote:

Meanwhile, in a neighboring country it is:

What should the manufacturer of the cable with plug do to ensure that the product meets ALL European standards?

pla20 wrote:

There is an unwritten rule that in sockets the phase should be on the left and 0 on the right.

The theory is wrong. The standards of all other countries that accept sockets as polarized refer to the phase contact on the RIGHT side.
But in Poland, sockets are considered unpolarized, which is why there are double sockets in which the polarity is reversed.

Countries polarize sockets for some order and security, even when the socket is unpolarized. The Polish case slightly disturbs this order on a global scale. In almost all countries with schuko, the phase is on the right, although the plug can be inserted in different ways. The angular one somehow forces the polarization to be correct. In Russia, the former USSR and Spain it is standardized. I know from my friends that in Germany and Austria there are sometimes problems with installation reception when the sockets have the phase on the left. At the construction site, installers receive small Chinese socket testers to connect them according to these testers, then control measurements of the entire installation are made

CYRUS2 wrote:

misiek1111 wrote:

This would reduce hazards, despite the dual sockets that reverse polarity.

What are these threats?

E.g.: kettle with metal casing:



1. The electric heater shorts out and shorts out to the metal bottom which is connected to the metal casing.
2. The internal fuse located in the socket is blown.



3. A blown fuse cuts off the brown wire connected to the right pin in the plug.



4. Depending on which side the phase in the socket is connected, the following scenarios will occur:

a) phase on the right side of the socket. At most we will hear: " F.... the Chinese crap has gone bad again ".
b) phase on the left side of the socket. Possible real electric shock.

Since the rest of the world (according to my observations and the entries of others) uses the phase on the right side of the plug, even though there is no rule in Poland, the phase should also be installed on the right side of the socket.
Otherwise, connecting class I devices poses a risk of electric shock.

PS For those digging into the topic of Schuco - #15.

misiek1111 wrote:

...in Poland, the phase should also be installed on the right side of the socket.
Otherwise, connecting class I devices poses a risk of electric shock.

Stop preaching this nonsense.
You have no idea what you are writing about.

Thanks for the substantive answer, especially to point 4 b).
I will do the same with your advice.

So get on with your studies and close this thread.

For example, when in a kettle with a detachable base, the PE contact in the base socket becomes tarnished.
Besides, I wrote: "Possible paralysis."

I asked

kkas12 wrote:

So get on with your studies and close this thread.

misiek1111 wrote:

For example, when in a kettle with a detachable base, the PE contact in the base socket becomes tarnished.
Besides, I wrote: "Possible paralysis."

Good!
And if the phase is on the right, the PE will not tarnish?

All devices with a CEE 7/7 plug must function properly regardless of polarity and must not contribute to electric shock. The phase on the left side of the socket in Poland and the Czech Republic only affects the fact that in most equipment the internal protections that are supposed to minimize damage may not work, i.e. it is no longer possible to repair, for example, a computer or TV power supply because its board will be seriously damaged. A kettle is generally a device that is polarized, because the heater has protection on both power cables. New glass kettles have wires for the right phase in the socket, but Zelmer kettles, for example, are designed for the left phase. Almost all UPS power supplies are designed for the right phase, except Volt Polska. Some of them have L and N contacts marked on the plug as in my photo above. Polarity does not affect the safety of use (except for e.g. lamps with threaded bulb holders) only losses in damage to the equipment and sometimes in audio equipment it may introduce interference and some UPSs may trigger the RCD on the left phase

Added after 19 [minutes]:

misiek1111 wrote:

Since the rest of the world (according to my observations and the entries of others) uses the phase on the right side of the plug, even though there is no rule in Poland, the phase should also be installed on the right side of the socket.

Only those countries that have adopted standardization for this socket have the phase on the right in a socket with a pin. Poland, the Czech Republic and Slovakia do not have standardized polarization, so we have complete freedom. Despite what some people say that "it has to be" on the left, it doesn't have to be, it's just someone trying to impose their views on everyone. If you are interested, I connect the phase on the right, as is customary in Europe and around the world, CEE 7/5 and CEE 7/3 sockets, because we use the same CEE 7/7 plug. I think everything has already been explained here