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Condenser tumble dryer with or without heat pump?

fafiks 371874 1053
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  • #1
    fafiks
    Level 17  
    Hello

    I would like to buy a washing dryer, I am inclined to the Bosch brand because I have a washing machine of this company and I am satisfied. I started browsing the available models and I was wondering whether to choose a condensing or condensing with the help of heat .. I know that energy savings in favor of a heat pump dryer but I am more interested in the quality of drying and the life of the device with a pump.

    The model I am interested in is the Bosch WTW85460PL

    I request information
  • #2
    iwaszkop
    Level 2  
    Hello,
    I spoke to a Bosch service technician and he strongly advised me against the heat pump dryer. There are too many elements that can break down and repairing such a dryer is very expensive (a new pump PLN 1000). Savings (the difference in the amount of electricity consumed, of course, depending on the use) is small, after 10 years +/- it pays back. A service technician recommended an ordinary condenser dryer to me, I chose the WTB86201PL and I am very pleased. Attention VERY !!!! Full automatic machine, quiet as far as possible, and finally I do not have to iron anything !!! No foolish programs, when I use the program, e.g. for the wardrobe, I literally take it out and fold it without ironing it to the wardrobe. I do not have bills for comparison, because I have been using it for less than a month, but since I do not use the iron too much now, the B energy class does not scare me at all. I seriously recommend it, it is one of the better home appliances purchases. I know I bought it too late. best regards
  • #3
    grzybbek
    Level 2  
    Hello,

    I am also at the stage of buying a dryer and my type is an ordinary condenser or condenser with a heat pump, which is probably not a surprise to anyone. For now, choosing a company is a secondary matter. The purchase price and possibly the lack of a heat pump, which can break down and is expensive to repair (based on the entry of the predecessor), speak for the usual condensation, but the question arises how much such a dryer heats the room (how much heat it gives off), because when it comes to winter it's not really a problem, but on hot summer days ...? Can anyone comment on this? The energy efficiency class at level B is also not great.

    On the other hand, a condenser dryer with a heat pump is of course more expensive, but consumes half as much energy (I compared the Bosch WTB86201PL and WTW85560PL models) and I do not agree with the predecessor that the difference is small and will pay off after 10 years. The heat pump model consumes (for the sake of simplicity I assume that twice as much energy, because in fact even less, 2.12 kWh compared to 4.61 kWh), so assuming that the dryer is to work, let's assume 5 times a week, i.e. 260 times a year (and for me probably even more often because the family 2 + 3), for one year, the energy consumption is 551 kWh for a dryer with a pump up to 1102 kWh for a dryer without a pump (I assumed 4.24 kWh for one cycle). As you can see, the difference in energy consumption, assuming that the average price of 1kWh is PLN 0.55, is as much as PLN 303 for one year, so if the compared condenser dryer costs PLN 1770 (source CENEO) and a condenser dryer with a heat pump costs PLN 2740, according to my calculations payback time is 3 years, not 10 years. Unless there is an error in the course of reasoning somewhere, I am asking for a correction.

    But that's not what I meant, because I can get over an ordinary condenser dryer with energy efficiency class B, if the heat pumps are not yet a refined element in the dryers and it is supposed to break down right after the warranty, but I can not imagine the eternal heat in bathroom (there is supposed to be a dryer there), if such dryers give off much heat.

    I would like a comment from a person who has a dryer as it actually looks.

    Best regards and prosperity in 2015.
  • #4
    fafiks
    Level 17  
    I finally bought the BOSCH WTW85460 and my wife and I are very satisfied. The dryer works 4-6 days a week, the electricity bill increased by about 25-30, it is easy to calculate that it is profitable to buy a model with a pump. As for the heat, the dryer is in a very small room with a gas combi oven and a washing machine. It is warm when all three devices work :) when the dryer itself works, I do not feel a large increase in temperature in the room.
  • #5
    grzybbek
    Level 2  
    Only your BOSCH WTW85460 dryer is with a heat pump and I meant the opinion of someone who has a condenser dryer without a heat pump.

    On the other hand, I was almost decided on the BOSCH WTW85560PL model, but comparing it to the lower class model, i.e. your BOSCH WTW85460 model, it is practically no different (new door and control panel design, minimally lower energy consumption in standby mode), and it costs money PLN 400 more, so I think the choice will be the BOSCH WTW85460. Especially since all owners are satisfied with it. I do not hide that I like the new model more, but the performance parameters are still more important to me.

    In addition, the model without the BOSCH WTB86201PL heat pump costs PLN 1770 and the model with the BOSCH WTW85460 pump PLN 2390, so it is even more advantageous than I described above because I adopted the BOSCH WTW85560PL model, which costs PLN 2740.
  • #6
    freebsd
    Level 39  
    fafiks wrote:
    I finally bought the BOSCH WTW85460 and my wife and I are very satisfied. The dryer works 4-6 days a week, the electricity bill has increased by about 25-30, it is easy to calculate that it is profitable to buy a model with a pump

    Request: do you have the option to measure how much energy your dryer consumes for one drying? If you have a simple wattmeter (energy meter), can you collect data from several dryings?
  • #7
    fafiks
    Level 17  
    Unfortunately, I do not have such a device. But after some time, I know one thing, despite the humidity sensor, it is worth checking during the drying process whether the laundry is already dry because it happens that the end is, for example, 15-20 minutes, and in general, the laundry can be pulled out.
  • #8
    freebsd
    Level 39  
    fafiks wrote:
    Unfortunately, I do not have such a device
    Pity :-( I am looking for someone who would measure the real energy consumption of a heat pump dryer. Thanks for the answer anyway :-)

    fafiks wrote:
    But after some time, I know one thing, despite the humidity sensor, it is worth checking during the drying process whether the laundry is already dry because it happens that the end is, for example, 15-20 minutes, and in general, the laundry can be pulled out.

    This does not occur in my dryer, but in about 10 months of use, we had to restart the drying twice (it was shorter, about 40 minutes). The last time the sock got on the filter so much that it disturbed the air flow ... We have a door with glass, but who would look there ... :-D
  • #9
    flash12
    Level 9  
    hello, I have the same dilemma as my predecessors in terms of choice.

    As for energy consumption and other parameters, the drying time and the amount of kWh per portion seem to be important (according to the cotton standard, a full basket is given) and there are significant differences.
    my wife insists that it should dry quickly, and cheap heat pump dryers are very slow. the most expensive or the cheapest condensers are fast. compiled according to the operating instructions

    cotton (revolutions) (full time min) (energy consumption kwh)
    bosch
    WTB86201PL 1k 126 4.61
    1.4k 108 3.84
    WTY87782PL 1k 157 2.13
    1.4k 133 1.72
    WTW85460PL 1k 226 2.01
    1.4k 204 1.81
    WTW85560PL 1k 226 2.12
    1.4k 204 1.91
    WTG86400PL 1k 158 4.61
    1.4k 140 3.84
    WTB86200PL 1k 111 4.08
    1.4k 95 3.5

    aeg
    T97689IH3 1k 215 1.51
    1.4k 189 1.32
    T86580IH3P 1k 170 1.94
    1.4k 149 1.7
    T75370AH3P 1k 159 2.17
    1.4k 139 1.9
    T76280AC 1k 146 4.8
    1.4k 130 4.21

    beko
    DPU 8360 X 1k 175 2.68
    DPU 7360 X 1k 156 2.15
    DPY 8506 GXB1 1k 174 1.42
    DCU 7330 1k 109 3.92

    electrolux
    EDP12074PDW 1k 131 3.92
    EWF12470W 1k 170 1.94
    EDH3498RDE 1k 200 2.28
    EDH3897SDE 1k 200 2.28
    EDH3686GDE 1k 181 2.65
    EDH3487RDE 1k 170 1.94

    others I didn't look or couldn't find parm (e.g. hoover doesn't tell the time).
    after substituting the cost of energy consumption and the amount of drying per week + the purchase price, interesting things come out.
    It turns out that with 3 dryings per week, for 10 years, it is worth buying either the cheapest Bosch model or the most expensive. it's almost one thing ...
    if more drying, it is better to buy with a pump, if less is the cheapest condensing one.
    NOTE: there are slight differences in the capacity of 8 / 9L dryers as a rule, but I did not add it to the table and did not take it into account.

    if anyone notices errors, please give me info - I'll correct it not all manufacturers are honest> some do not clearly state the relevant parameters, so it is easy to compare.
    I don't know what to choose ...
    best regards
  • #10
    freebsd
    Level 39  
    flash12 wrote:
    others I didn't look or couldn't find parm (e.g. hoover doesn't tell the time).
    Mine, without a heat pump, takes 60 to 120 minutes to dry. Thin things faster, towels longer. Generally, you can dry and wash at the same time: when the second wash is finished, take the dry laundry out of the first wash.

    flash12 wrote:
    I don't know what to choose ...

    Also check:
    - Volume.
    - Adjusting the door, gaskets.
    - How is it cleaned (filters). The amount of "dust" after drying is such that we clean the filter after each drying. Our cleaning involves collecting this dust with your fingers - it looks like a thin layer of felt (we have one filter). We rinse the heat exchanger in the shower once a month. I've been looking at dryers in the store recently and they had stickers placed so cleverly that it was hard to see how to clean them.

    The calculation of the energy consumption is still different, if you take the average energy consumption from my measurements for the calculation. In a few days, I will have complete two-month data.

    PS: Correct the post, large sentences, etc.
  • #11
    Czokid
    Level 3  
    I am the former owner of an expensive and, according to many opinions, a sensational Electrolux EDH97981W heat pump condenser dryer for almost PLN 3,000, which broke down in less than 3 years. And the heat pump broke down - the cost of replacement is the basis with a compressor - PLN 1,850 + service. I had to throw it out and went back to the exhaust straight. There is only one model available on the market. Honestly, I was naive that I had been tricked by the heat pump earlier. Supposedly, it is supposed to take half the energy, but if you calculate the difference in price, this difference returns after 6 years, so taking into account that the heat pump dryer lasted less than 3 years, it makes no sense to spend this extra money. For the one with a heat pump and humidity sensors, when you put a full load, it dried for over 2 hours. The exhaust air system does this in less than an hour. And the options for ironing or for the wardrobe can be achieved in this straight exhaust, while monitoring the end of drying (damp for ironing, dried warm for the wardrobe). I highly recommend it to anyone who has good ventilation at home. And those who do not have the same, but with the same steam condensation, which takes slightly more current than the exhaust (condensation costs), but is structurally simple as opposed to those with a heat pump. I will never buy an Electrolux heat pump again.
  • #12
    MG MARCIN
    Level 2  
    Hello to all owners of an equally wonderful and durable model of the Electrolux EDH97981W dryer for almost PLN 3,000.
    I have literally the same situation !!!!
    I can see that I was not the only one who was naive.
    Thanks, I won't even fix it.
    ELEKTROLUX - NEVER IN MY HOME !!!
  • #13
    pilu
    Level 12  
    I know that the topic is old, but I am faced with a dilemma whether the old Bauknecht condenser dryer pays off for me to replace it with a heat pump dryer.

    Does putting such a heat pump inside the house make any energy sense? After all, for the evaporation of water from clothes, energy is taken from the environment (there is no heater in the pump), so such a heat pump will "take", for example, 2kWh of heat from my bathroom, which I will have to supplement with an oil / gas / coal stove.
    I don't see any savings here.
    What do you think about it?

    Bartek
  • #14
    freebsd
    Level 39  
    A very interesting observation.
    I think that a heat pump dryer will take energy from the environment, but also give it back to it - in addition to what will be used for:
    - Heating the condensed water
    - Warm clothes.
    However, the heat from the clothes will be dissipated into the house, as will the heat from the condensed water, unless you pour out the water (e.g. the tank is full). Alternatively, the dryer immediately pumps the condensed water into the sewage.
    Electricity is usually more expensive than thermal energy obtained from a furnace or CO. This means that it is not profitable to generate energy from electricity.

    Despite the above, taking into account the complicated structure of the heat pump dryer, its purchase price, longer drying time, dirt on the heat exchangers, I do not see the point in purchasing such a dryer.
    I'm still curious how much electricity heat pump dryers actually consume, because according to in my tests it is a classic condenser dryer, it does not consume so much energy.
  • #15
    levy^
    Level 16  
    freebsd wrote:
    A very interesting observation.
    I think that a heat pump dryer will take energy from the environment, but also give it back to it - in addition to what will be used for:
    - Heating the condensed water
    - Warm clothes.
    However, the heat from the clothes will be dissipated into the house, as will the heat from the condensed water, unless you pour out the water (e.g. the tank is full). Alternatively, the dryer immediately pumps the condensed water into the sewage.
    Electricity is usually more expensive than thermal energy obtained from a furnace or CO. This means that it is not profitable to generate energy from electricity.

    Despite the above, taking into account the complicated structure of the heat pump dryer, its purchase price, longer drying time, dirt on the heat exchangers, I do not see the point in purchasing such a dryer.
    I'm still curious how much electricity heat pump dryers actually consume, because according to in my tests it is a classic condenser dryer, it does not consume so much energy.


    Hello

    The heat pump dryer takes energy but only from the socket and from humid air (from clothes). What is cooled by the evaporator is immediately heated by the condenser.

    Last week I bought a heat pump dryer only because I happened to repair it at a customer who was over 10 years old, and it was electrolux. It was enough to clean the evaporator
  • #16
    freebsd
    Level 39  
    @ levy ^ Did you buy with a heat pump? Do you have the option to measure the electricity consumed by your dryer? If so, can you take several measurements, e.g. from 10 dryings?
  • #17
    levy^
    Level 16  
    Unfortunately, I do not have a measuring device that logs data. It will definitely use less energy than the classic one based on heaters.
  • #18
    freebsd
    Level 39  
    @ levy ^ I can't find anyone with a heat pump dryer, a simple wattmeter, and a piece of paper with a pencil on it :-( I am curious how much less it consumes this energy - having such data, you can make a real calculation of the profitability of purchasing a more expensive device.
  • #19
    levy^
    Level 16  
    Generally, I bought this dryer due to the fact that I do not like the smell of drying laundry, as well as a test / inspection / checking item. I deal with refrigeration and I have a lot to do with household appliances. If it breaks down - it will be repaired. If I can not repair because I have a prototype after testing, then I will convert it to a different control.

    I don't need a wattmeter to be sure it will use less electricity than a heater. The pump has a closed circuit, and the heater circuit is open and a large amount of heat is lost forever
  • #20
    freebsd
    Level 39  
    levy^ wrote:
    I don't need a wattmeter to be sure it will use less electricity than a heater. The pump has a closed circuit, and the heater circuit is open and a large amount of heat is lost forever

    This is not what I mean, but to calculate the profitability of purchasing a more expensive device. How long is the amortization of the difference in the purchase price. Will it have time to return before it requires repair or cleaning by the service?
    In addition, drying with the heat pump takes longer. In turn, the heat from the classic dryer stays in the apartment, so it is not lost - and there is not so much of it.

    Can you write how did you clean the dryer at the customer? There are two heat exchangers there - how did you get into them, what did you clean with? The evaporator in my LG refrigerator is so dense that it is impossible to clean the inside of it thoroughly.
    How much does such a service (cleaning) cost? How often do you have to do them for the dryer to lose efficiency?
  • #21
    levy^
    Level 16  
    freebsd wrote:

    This is not what I mean, but to calculate the profitability of purchasing a more expensive device. How long is the amortization of the difference in the purchase price. Will it have time to return before it requires repair or cleaning by the service?


    As I wrote before. I didn't pay attention to it. I bought it as a curiosity for testing

    freebsd wrote:

    In addition, drying with the heat pump takes longer.


    not true

    freebsd wrote:

    In turn, the heat from the classic dryer stays in the apartment, so it is not lost - and there is not so much of it.

    :) I did not buy a dryer to heat my home, but to dry clothes. What else will you say if the dryer will heat your apartment when it will be over 30oC outside


    freebsd wrote:

    Can you write how did you clean the dryer at the customer? There are two heat exchangers there - how did you get into them, what did you clean with? The evaporator in my LG refrigerator is so dense that it is impossible to clean the inside of it thoroughly.
    How much does such a service (cleaning) cost? How often do you have to do them for the dryer to lose efficiency?


    It took me 3 hours, the cost was about PLN 100 because I charged myself for the materials. I practically did it for free for educational purposes because I have never had to deal with such a dryer. I used a comb, antifungal fluids for air conditioning and pressurized water. Front access only. How often? It depends on various factors. After 10 years, the evaporator was completely killed in his house, but because he had a game at home (3 dogs and 3 cats)
  • #22
    teodor2424
    Level 11  
    Hello.
    I plan to purchase a laundry dryer.
    Could any of the honorable forum members recommend a model?
    My requirements and parameters:
    - use 2-3 times / week
    - I mainly care about clothes without ironing
    - without heat pump
    - up to PLN 2,500
    - easy access to filters
    - long service life :)

    I found the following models:
    Bosch WTB86201PL
    Hotpoint-Ariston AQC9 4F5 T / Z1 (EU)
    Whirlpool AHIC 999P
    Whirlpool HSCX 80425
    Whirlpool HSCX 80311
    Candy GVC D1013B-S

    I am asking for suggestions
    or maybe you have other, better interesting ones?
    I am asking for advice.
  • #23
    freebsd
    Level 39  
    @ teodor2424 The dryer does not need any frills. According to It is worth paying attention to the largest possible door and whether it has a humidity sensor. Choose the cheapest and the quietest - I think so.
  • #24
    teodor2424
    Level 11  
    and I found out that some of what I mentioned are with a heat pump (which I do not want) And on the website of the intern store. they say they are without.
    Only the reasonable model Bosch WTB86201PL remains
    Because I can not find anything else without the pump as logical.
  • #25
    teodor2424
    Level 11  
    Which one should you choose ???
    WTG86400PL
    if
    WTB86201pl
    Any differences or just the display and knob in a different place ??
  • #26
    Jericho24
    Level 20  
    What have you finally bought and how is it working?
  • #27
    giggy
    Level 2  
    But you messed my mind ... ;-) in that case, I start my search again - drying max 2-3 / week, so there is no point in taking it with a heat pump ... Bosch company only which model? What do you recommend?
  • #28
    levy^
    Level 16  
    I managed to save another dryer from being dumped for scrap. A small leak found and soldered. You had to add a tee on the suction side and insert a service valve. Now it dries great.

    Condenser tumble dryer with or without heat pump? Condenser tumble dryer with or without heat pump?
  • #29
    Arbiter
    Level 15  
    nice joy after such a repair.

    I found out today from Bosch that condensing pumps are more convenient because they have automatic cleaning of the exchanger. that is, you do not need to pull out crap what drying. You don't have to pull it out at all because it washes itself.

    Which is worth buying - I read the reviews myself because I haven't bought it yet
  • #30
    Zukes
    Level 10  
    I have had a Siemens heat pump dryer for 5 years. Fortunately, I had a 5-year warranty.
    After 3 years, the heat pump became so dirty that the device stopped drying.
    The service technician told me that this fault is like a bank only depends on the amount of drying. If I had a 2-year warranty, I would have to add.
    Kolenja, such a repair awaits me after the next 3 years. But then I will buy a regular dryer.
    After 4 years, the drum broke - it simply fell apart.

    And most importantly, what the sellers will not tell you, the energy gain is only for new, clean devices, as it becomes dirty, it drops to almost 0 compared to ordinary devices.

    And in general, the drying performance is weaker than in conventional dryers.