Sofar Solar KTL-X Inverter: RS485 MODBUS Integration with Domoticz - Setup & Tips [90]

Krzychooo wrote:

I've been interested in the subject for a long time, but I can't understand why you make such breakneck inventions to find out what can be read from the meter (1.8 and 2.8) and the inverter (total)?
I am interested in this because I want to insert information from the current state of the installation into the control of receivers (4 heaters on 3 phases, 1.5 kW each), so as to adjust consumption in REAL TIME to production and avoid maximum accumulation in the network. From what I see you are interested in a summary, i.e. what I wrote at the beginning.
I'm wrong?
OK, I don't care, but isn't it better to put the above-mentioned data into a spreadsheet, let's say every week/10 days/month and have everything at your fingertips in any format and on charts?

I'm just asking, sorry.

Krzychoo
8kWp Sofar8.8

Hello. There was nothing about heaters in this topic, were you wrong by any chance?

Added after 1 [minutes]:

Marian143 wrote:

Krzychooo wrote:

I've been interested in the subject for a long time, but I can't understand why you make such breakneck inventions to find out what can be read from the meter (1.8 and 2.8) and the inverter (total)?
I am interested in this because I want to insert information from the current state of the installation into the control of receivers (4 heaters on 3 phases, 1.5 kW each), so as to adjust consumption in REAL TIME to production and avoid maximum accumulation in the network. From what I see you are interested in a summary, i.e. what I wrote at the beginning.
I'm wrong?
OK, I don't care, but isn't it better to put the above-mentioned data into a spreadsheet, let's say every week/10 days/month and have everything at your fingertips in any format and on charts?

I'm just asking, sorry.

Krzychoo
8kWp Sofar8.8

Hello. There was nothing about heaters in this topic, were you wrong by any chance?

Excuse me, I wanted to ask if in the subject of heaters and adjusting consumption in REAL TIME to production and bypassing the maximum accumulation in the network, something has been achieved?

Marian143 wrote:

... Excuse me, I wanted to ask if in the subject of heaters and adjusting consumption in REAL TIME to production and bypassing the maximum accumulation in the network, something has been achieved?

Well, I'm far in the field right now. I haven't finished the installation yet...
I'm constantly inventing and changing things, blessing my pace at the moment. :D

The plan is that in the additional 80L boiler connected in series BEFORE the old 100L
heat water with a 3x1.5kW heater controlled by Arduino or Rpi based on temperature measurements
in the boiler, central heating and hot water AND for online information from the inverter. I also want the heat from this water via
introduce the coil with a separate pump Alpha1 (PWM) to the central heating
Knowing life and my plans, it will still take time, although I will solder the tubes THIS week!!! :D

Later I'll plug it in briefly to consume my surplus energy during the season, in the meantime getting distracted
communication with SOFAR. That's my plan for the pandemic.
Of course, I will be proud of the success, if it happens. Probably a failure too, looking for a helping hand / brain.

TadekK wrote:

Krzychooo wrote:

.... adjust consumption in REAL TIME to production and avoid grid accumulation as much as possible. ...

All information is collected in real time. I could - if it would give me anything - make any control based on "instantaneous" values ... I have the production state sampled every 10 seconds, the consumption state I sample at the moment (RESTem) every 10 minutes - but I can change it freely. I do not need consumption data more often, because my installation is too small (too small roof ...) for my consumption ... So I never have "overproduction" ...
And I do it so that it counts for itself and I don't have to copy anything to the spreadsheet once a week..
In my solution, I have several very nice formats showing the operation of the installation - including the calculation of the "production capacity curve of the installation" as a function of the current time (the algorithm calculates the current angle of incidence of sunlight on my panels from appropriate astronomical formulas ...).

I like such intellectual games - being a retired IT specialist, I prefer to show off something impressive on WeMos D1 mini Pro (ESP8266) than to solve crossword puzzles ... The cost of all the equipment necessary to carry out my needlework does not exceed PLN 150 ...


I did not include the price of the MEW-01 meter above (it kills a bit ...), but I am having unofficial talks with people from Tauron to be able to read my meter through their "AMI-Plus interface" and be able to eliminate the "MEW-01 doubling Tauron". ..

Hello, I like your design. Soon I will also have an installation with Sofar. The question is, did you manage to get along with Tauron "to be able to read my meter through their "AMI-Plus interface"?
Can you share the soft for Wemos?

Krzychooo wrote:

...Of course, I will boast about success, if it happens. Probably a failure too, looking for a helping hand / brain ...

Be proud of your progress.
I am doing something similar to your idea.

FrankAB wrote:

Be proud of your progress.

Prego.

The current state is that the tubes are soldered, leaks removed pumps and heaters temporarily connected for testing,
which has been going on for several days. After these few days, however, I can see that the concept is OK, the system works smoothly and efficiently.
It's only 4.5 kW (3x 1.5), but it manages to heat 180 liters of water (100 liters in the old tank + 80 in the new one in which there are
these heaters. The old Wilo circulation pump (28W) after descaling is able to push it through the system and equalize the temperatures
to about 45-55 degrees. If the circulation is not working, I reach about 78 degrees, including 80L. Then the heater does not heat.
It has its own thermostat and safety features so keep it that way.

The Alpha1 pump pushes the central heating water through the coil in this tank (80L) and calmly achieves the parameters required for me, i.e. about 32-36 degrees.
I have floorstanders everywhere and 3 cauliflowers in the attic, but they're Radsons on steroids so that suits them too.
I will add that I now have 3 heat sources in the system, because there is also a propane gas stove and a water fireplace next to it.
Everything works independently, but... each needs electricity.

In general, the concept has worked (so far) and it seems to be a good direction. The experiment was not expensive, because I planned anyway
an additional container, and most of the pipes and fittings I had "in the box" so it was cheap.
Now only until winter I have to do the rest, i.e. AI
Of course it's my ai it'll just be a bunch of Nano's (Atmega328) that will communicate (somehow, haven't decided how yet)
and they will have the task of embracing this chaos. Why several and not one? Because they are ridiculously cheap, but they have little space for the program
and data. In addition, such a system will be more resistant to errors and failures. If the soft or the board (made in prc) breaks down from e.g
pumps then heaters will continue to be controlled and the heat will not disappear. I think so. (I also have a dozen drivers for everything in the car
so here's an example.)

A separate topic is where to get the data to bypass accumulation in the "network storage". Originally, I wanted to take it directly
with SOFAR, but the more I think about it, the more sense I see in adding a counter or something like "OneMeter" to the existing one
to have comprehensive data on the current energy balance online and not to uselessly exceed the current surplus from production.
A topic for thought and analysis. I have time until winter, because currently I have to consume my surplus online anyway, (for today
is 3013kWh net).
After receiving what is mine, I would like to bypass the accumulation as much as possible in real time - "in statu nascendi".

After all, it is about at least a dozen or so percent (because it is unlikely to miss a full discount), and it is much more
than the best investment in diamonds, gold or oil.
And without the additional Belka tax...

Krzychooo wrote:

because currently I have to consume my surplus online anyway,

.. and so the whole "greenness" of RES took a head
Normally, you would reduce the heating or burn the gas, and that's how tons of green coal will go.

This is not an accusation against you.. I would do it myself.
These are my thoughts - the policy of driving consumption instead of limiting it.

Krzychooo wrote:

A separate topic is where to get the data to bypass accumulation in the "network storage". Originally, I wanted to take it directly
with SOFAR, but the more I think about it, the more sense I see in adding a counter or something like "OneMeter" to the existing one
to have comprehensive data on the current energy balance online and not to uselessly exceed the current surplus from production.
A topic for thought and analysis

As onemeter works with your meter from ZE, it is a solution, another solution is to set up a meter with modbus (e.g. sdm72M) and read from it.

starob wrote:

.. and so the whole "greenness" of RES took a head
Normally, you would reduce the heating or burn the gas, and that's how tons of green coal will go.

Haha! For years I burn propane or wood from a forest that previously absorbed this CO2...
And the surplus came from the fact that I specially oversized the installation to "burn" fusion in my own home
without bothering with all that prehistoric crap. If only I had made these inventions in the "boiler room" earlier,
there would be no storage problem.

But I promise to improve.

Oversizing is Ok, your surpluses are burnt by your neighbors locally.
The problem is, now you want it back and "they" make it out of coal. You want it and you don't know what to do with it.

Seriously, if I had such a problem, I would use a meter to control the load and control the heaters to maximize auto consumption. Group control, switching between phases... ?
You need to know the actual load. Even a girl like this
https://www.elektroda.pl/rtvforum/topic3709584.html#gallery-2

Krzychooo wrote:

...Originally I wanted to take it directly
with SOFAR, but the more I think about it, the more I see the point in adding some counter...

To manage it sensibly, you need data from Sofar and the meter.
I bought the DDS578MR on a well-known portal and thanks to my friend @starob I communicate with him from the Node-RED program via RS485.
In the near future I will also establish communication with Sofar (now I don't want to run a wire through the whole house).
Colleague @klon111 described how to download data from Sofar via LAN, but these are only data from his website, and RS485 is everything.
The RPi will send this data to Micrologix 1200, and it will also use its own sensors to do the "dirty work" controlling contactors and SSR.
I did the hydraulic part of the heating (a little by myself, a little with the help of professionals) during the conversion of the farm building into a residential house.
At first, there was only a PER-EKO solid fuel boiler and a boiler to have hot water.
When the professionals laid the underfloor heating, I placed an electric heater with a power of 1.7 kW between the boiler and the underfloor heating unit.
We did not live in this house over the winter and to protect it from freezing for 5 hours on the night tariff, the pump and the heater were turned on by a time relay.
Last year, parallel to the solid fuel boiler, I added an electric boiler with 3 heaters of about 2kW each.
It had a room controller and 2 contactors. I completely changed its power supply and after connecting the heaters: 2 in parallel and 1 in series, it works in this heating season.
At a temperature around zero, it heats 68 sq m, if it was cooler, I turned on the previously installed heater.
With this combination of coils, I didn't have to turn on his pump; The underfloor pump was working perfectly fine, and at medium speed.
In the autumn, 9.9 kWp panels were installed and I had some electricity, and I took a little more from the supplier and when more sunny days come, I will give it back.
Now I will be thundered that I am not "eco", but what the hell.
If there is no electricity, I have a fireplace, and connecting the heaters to the panels I tested during a few days between installing the panels and the meter.
Before the next heating season, I'm going to start all automation.

starob wrote:

...
Seriously, if I had such a problem, I would use a meter to control the load and control the heaters to maximize auto consumption. Group control, switching between phases...

I agree with the previous speaker 100%, but...

... I get the impression from your statement that you either didn't read or don't remember what I wrote earlier.
My main goal is to bypass the storage on the network, which is auto-consumption, which has this advantage
(the main one for me) that I don't lose 20%, whatever it is.
This (auto-consumption) also has the disadvantage that you have to do it with sense, and not like some people I know who
for example, they installed a lot of lamps and goodies in the garden - "because they now have electricity _for free_". Nice...
How did they do it that they have it for free, when it has been known for a long time that there is no such thing
like "free lunches". I had to throw over PLN 32k for my kilowatts. And I don't remember that
it was "free".

Added after 15 [minutes]:

FrankAB wrote:

krzychooo wrote:
...Originally I wanted to take it directly
with SOFAR, but the more I think about it, the more I see the point in adding some counter...

To manage it sensibly, you need data from Sofar and the meter.

Depends on who cares.
I am not interested in summaries for tables and charts, because I do it myself from the beginning in the spreadsheet based on the readings
three data. Two from the meter (1.8 and 2.8) and total production from SOFAR.
On this basis, I can calculate everything I do, and actually "it counts" in the sheet when I add another 3 numbers
every 2 weeks. Of course, it can be automated as others do, and kudos to them for that, but I'm interested in "automatic"
only that my heaters turn on sequentially so that I don't have to store almost anything and buy as little as possible.
After all, the warehouse is -20% of potential profits/savings (delete as appropriate), and additional consumption is also
burdened with an additional 20% tribute, because that's how invoices are settled...
And here I see the clou of the problem for the installation to pay off sensibly and give some profits.

Krzychooo wrote:

I get the impression from your post that you either didn't read or don't remember what I wrote before.

It's almost true. I read everything - you expressed the beginning of your entry in the mode so declaring it, I thought that you have it all thought out and is not subject to discussion.
I only referred to the need to have "own" meter.
The bigger problem is that at the same time you sell one phase and buy your electricity with a 20% protection fee with the other. This must be eliminated when talking about auto-consumption

starob wrote:

... I read everything - you expressed the beginning of your entry in such a declarative mode, I assumed that you have it all thought out and is not subject to discussion.
I only referred to the need to have "own" meter.

And sorry, I didn't understand.
Most importantly, we don't have to fight. :lol:

As for the phases, that's why I have 3x 1.5kW with the option of adding more, e.g. 3x 1kW or 1x 1-2kW in the old tank.
Who will work will be the task of "ai".

Krzychooo wrote:

[...Of course, it can be automated as others do, and kudos to them for that, but I'm interested in "automatically"
only that the heaters turn on sequentially so that I don't have to store almost anything and buy as little as possible.....

I'm interested in a little more than auto-consumption, which is also important.
Since I have 600 m of overhead line from 1970 to the transformer station, the voltage drops by 14 V after switching on the 2 kW heater.
If any household appliance with more power turns on:
washing machine, dishwasher, oven, induction hob, etc
the system should switch heating to the least loaded phase at the moment
whether the sun is shining or not.
Because Sofar sleeps at night, I have to use the meter to read the network parameters.
I read your posts long ago and learned a lot from them, and from other colleagues as well.

FrankAB wrote:

Since I have 600 m of overhead line from 1970 to the transformer station, the voltage drops by 14 V after switching on the 2 kW heater.
If any household appliance with more power turns on:
washing machine, dishwasher, oven, induction hob, etc
the system should switch heating to the least loaded phase at the moment
whether the sun is shining or not.

Or maybe it would be enough for you automatic phase switch e.g. PF-431 or PF-451 with adjustable thresholds?
Alternatively, using one of the available types as a driver for a larger system.

Krzychooo wrote:

Or maybe it would be enough for you automatic phase switch e.g. PF-431 or PF-451 with adjustable thresholds?
Alternatively, using one of the available types as a driver for a larger system.

I have to switch on: 2 pumps, heater in the heater, heater in the boiler,
heaters in an electric boiler connected in various configurations (2 in parallel + 1 in series for 230 V, each of them for 230 V).
To read: 2 pressures, 2 temperatures analog, with 4 digital, Sofar, DDS578MR and possibly a Tauron counter.
For visualization: Panel View 300 Micro, PC and smartphone.
Why do I need the PF-x?
Why didn't you quote 1 sentence?

FrankAB wrote:

Krzychooo wrote:

Or maybe it would be enough for you automatic phase switch e.g. PF-431 or PF-451 with adjustable thresholds?
Alternatively, using one of the available types as a driver for a larger system.

I have to switch on: 2 pumps, heater in the heater, heater in the boiler, heaters in the electric boiler combined in different
configurations (2 in parallel + 1 in series at 230V, each at 230V).

If you assume this 14V voltage drop in a 600m loop with 2kW on, that would be "washing machine, dishwasher, oven, induction hob, etc"
together they should give a drop of about 50V, which excludes their simultaneous use, and what to talk about heaters, even in series.
I was thinking of a simple solution to slightly improve the phase load.
Have you checked the loop impedance at home?

FrankAB wrote:

To read: 2 pressures, 2 temperatures analog, with 4 digital, Sofar, DDS578MR and possibly a Tauron counter.
For visualization: Panel View 300 Micro, PC and smartphone.
Why do I need the PF-x?
Why didn't you quote 1 sentence?

The PF-x could solve the problem of more even phase loading, perhaps not one, (but then they could go crazy and make a disco).

And 1 sentence accidentally cut out with my quote.

Added after 9 [minutes]:

FrankAB wrote:

In the fall, 9.9 kWp panels were installed and I had some electricity, and I took a little more from the supplier
and when sunnier days come, I will give it back to him.

If I understand correctly, you haven't lived with the installation for years yet.
I'm worried about the impedance of your loop, because if 2kW gives 14V voltage drop, you may have problems
similar to mine in the first year.
What are your nominal phase voltages around noon?

I have an impedance of about 650 mOhm per phase (350 m to the transformer), PV power is 8kW (up to 9), but the voltage jumped around 7-8V.
At your 600 meters, 10kWp and probably bad impedance, I see darkness...
Phew, phew...

1. Home appliances are connected to different phases.
2. There is such a thing as the simultaneity factor.
3. There is no such thing as a simple solution to my situation with PF-x.
4. I use such a connection of heaters other than normal in order not to turn on the circulation pump.
After applying 230 V to the heater (and there are 3 of them in the boiler), it has a normal flow rate through
electric boiler too high temperature and requires turning on the pump which of course the system will
would do if I needed more heating power.
5. In the summer, the temperature of the panels will increase and they will not have such efficiency.
6. It's cold and if the sun comes out from behind a cloud I had 11kW and 250V for a while.
7. The subject of the thread is the connection via Modbus to Sofar, and since my colleagues already work, it is also for me
should be a few days too.

FrankAB wrote:

1. Home appliances are connected to different phases.
2. There is such a thing as the simultaneity factor.
3. There is no such thing as a simple solution to my situation with PF-x.
4. I use such a connection of heaters other than normal in order not to turn on the circulation pump.
After applying 230 V to the heater (and there are 3 of them in the boiler), it has a normal flow rate through
electric boiler too high temperature and requires turning on the pump which of course the system will
would do if I needed more heating power.
5. In the summer, the temperature of the panels will increase and they will not have such efficiency.
6. It's cold and if the sun comes out from behind a cloud I had 11kW and 250V for a while.
7. The subject of the thread is the connection via Modbus to Sofar, and since my colleagues already work, it is also for me
should be a few days too.

I think our exchange of thoughts has stepped on thin ice.
Thanks for any clarification, but:

ad 1. - of course I know it, but I only estimated the total voltage drops based on theory
o modest input data (2kW, 14V, 600m). Besides, it is extremely unlikely to be simultaneous
use of full power by the above-mentioned devices.

ad 2. - There is such a thing, but the term "coefficient of simultaneity" has been used for several decades.
Having lived in the shadow of overhead grids and old transformers on poles, I know
that your bigger problem may be the loop impedance, not the equal load on the phases. You have for sure
many neighbors who probably have a vague idea of the problem and charge very unevenly and randomly
individual phases. That's how it is for me and there's nothing I can do about it

ad 3. - I did not claim that it is a panacea for the problem. I just mentioned the possibility.
I guess that's what forums are for...?

ad 5. - I agree, but my experience also shows that in summer there are very large fluctuations in the middle of the day
voltages, and with the rapid growth of PV installations, this is a growing problem, also for DSOs.
Our transmission networks were built as one-way and currently have a big problem with RES.

ad 7. - Right! and with this statement I end my argument.

I connected the computer through the USB->RS-485 adapter with a 2x cable to the Sofar RJ-45 socket
and thanks to my friend @starob I am reading data from it with Node-RED.

FrankAB wrote:

Be proud of your progress.

Episode two.

As of today, a week after the launch of the initial "automation".
Preliminary, because for the time being truncated from SSR to the heaters (I turn them on manually) and does not take into account any data
with Sofar, because I haven't started communication with him yet. I also don't have any counter to read the data
from the balance sheet, but that's less important.
What conclusions?

Having an initial algorithm (quite simple) to control the central heating circulation pump (Alpha1 PWM), the circulation pump
and manual control of the heaters, and at the same time having a bad time for experiments because winter is coming
ends and the heating season is rather symbolic, I have such an effect in the proportions of energy consumption as in the picture.



Of course, the weather has a big impact on this graph, but you can still see something. Overall I'm happy with these
data. We'll see what happens next. I have to polish the pump control algorithm and finally connect it
these SSRs before the heaters, but today I connected the SD card to the system and collect data from all sensors
temperature, PWM and circulating pump status. When the SSRs arrive, the power used will come to data.
We will see.
I now have resistance to hot water, right in front of the valve, and the floor is also evenly warm. Gas stove of course
completely off.

Maybe we should start a new thread, e.g. optimization of electricity consumption from PV ?
The topic is interesting, broad and evolving as this technology develops.
Moderator will be happy, and we will avoid punishment and penance...

Krzychooo wrote:

The moderator will be happy, and we will avoid punishment and penance...

Until some kindly kindly report, the moderator does not look here

Regarding the topic - MODBUS to Sofar and further to Domoticz - I have it solved like this:

Dongle - made according to the instructions:

https://github.com/pawelka/sofarsolar_esp_rs485_logger

And from MQTT to Domoticz flow in Node-RED
(attached)

Nice this flow; you can barely see anything on the screen and if it does what you write about it's OK.
You still need to load data from Sofar to the MQTT broker - you load them and we?

FrankAB wrote:

You load them and we?

There's a slightly different philosophy here than what YOU tinker with. In this solution, the logger directly uploads data to the broker.
And with HA you don't even need node-red. This node is only for the actual "converting" of data for Domoticz

Thanks for the explanation.
I communicate with Sofar directly over Modbus via RS-485 and hence my question.

FrankAB wrote:

I communicate with Sofar directly over Modbus via RS-485

... and very well - a cable is a cable
For stubborn, after replacing the software in ESP with the RS server, you could have the same as you have, only after Wifi - if you changed your mind.

starob wrote:

...In this solution, the logger directly uploads data to the broker.
And with HA you don't even need node-red. This node is only for the actual "converting" of data for Domoticz

The logger uploads the data to the LAN, and the broker is on the PC.
How does this data get into the MQTT?

FrankAB wrote:

How does this data get into the MQTT?

In the description https://github.com/pawelka/sofarsolar esp rs485 logger you can see the logger configuration page - you fill it with your data and according to this they go to the MQTT broker (you probably have Mosqutto?)

I don't have HA so I didn't open this page: https://github.com/pawelka/hassio-addons
and that's where it's laid out in layman's terms.
Thanks for pointing me to the right source of information.