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Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer

VITEXS 12261 13

TL;DR

  • A welding machine transformer got another modification toward a more professional build.
  • The setup emphasizes strong power in amperes and handles with wires for welding electrodes.
  • The welding machine is ready for a colleague, and another unit has already been built.
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Treść została przetłumaczona polish » english Zobacz oryginalną wersję tematu
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  • Close-up photo of a transformer with a display and welding machine cables.
    Hello,

    This is another modification of the transformer for the welder to a more professional one. Strong power in amperes, and handles (handles) with wires of welding electrodes. Finally, the welding machine is ready for a colleague and the next one is built.
    Attachments:
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210111_213139.jpg (2.87 MB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
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    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210110_152801.jpg (935.16 KB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210110_152747.jpg (486.96 KB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210110_152635.jpg (4.45 MB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210110_152655.jpg (3.33 MB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210114_181705.jpg (579.74 KB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210114_181644.jpg (410.22 KB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210113_211616.jpg (1.57 MB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210113_211551.jpg (1.2 MB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
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    Cool? Ranking DIY
    About Author
    VITEXS
    Level 12  
    Offline 
    VITEXS wrote 140 posts with rating 85, helped 3 times. Live in city Opole. Been with us since 2006 year.
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  • #2 19184798
    zgierzman
    Level 31  
    Posts: 1776
    Help: 108
    Rate: 1537
    Board Language: polish
    I like the modification itself, but the description is not even suitable for Pudelka, let alone on the technical forum. One introductory sentence, one ending and three words of content:

    VITEXS wrote:
    Massive power in amperes


    Power is expressed in watts and amps are a unit of current.
    "Powerful", you mean how much? In numbers. And how much more than the classic cable modification?
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  • #3 19184825
    pier
    Level 24  
    Posts: 2444
    Help: 40
    Rate: 1891
    Board Language: polish
    How, what are the flat bars connected to each other?
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  • #4 19184867
    Wirnick
    Level 30  
    Posts: 1774
    Help: 72
    Rate: 239
    Board Language: polish
    pier wrote:
    How, what are the flat bars connected to each other?

    You ahead of me with a question. The most important is the contact area of Cu to Cu. The clamping of the contact surface is best performed by riveting with steel rivets (depending on expansion) or by welding. Tinning reduces the conductivity of the junction. The protection of the joint against oxidation can be done with pastes or finally by soldering. I still have a note for use in current brass circuits. Overall - great, few words and a lot of examples to follow.
  • #5 19184895
    szymon122
    Level 38  
    Posts: 4085
    Help: 302
    Rate: 754
    Board Language: polish
    What idle current? What welding current?
    What was the process of creating a winding from a copper flat bar? Did you buy a finished flat bar?
  • #6 19185529
    george2002

    Level 21  
    Posts: 526
    Rate: 158
    Board Language: polish
    And how does the driver, the one with the display, work? You can ask for some settings because I have the same and I am constantly struggling with the settings :D
    Company Account:
    GS electronic Grzegorz Stoliński
    2 Pułku Lotniczego 18, Kraków, 31-857 | Company Website: www.gselectronic.pl
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  • #8 19186488
    398216 Usunięty
    Level 43  
    Posts: 34006
    Help: 3912
    Rate: 9179
    Board Language: polish
    What are the insulated coils of a flat bar among themselves?
  • #9 19186529
    VITEXS
    Level 12  
    Posts: 140
    Help: 3
    Rate: 85
    Board Language: polish
    The insulation between the windings is mica or textolite, but rather pressboard 0.50 mm plus resin for the windings and, of course, a glass fiber wrap, all from a colleague who runs a company for rewinding motors - transformers. A lot of inquiries about transformer outputs, how they are made (riveted + soldering or hard soldering with silver alloy) in the photos shown. Today I am realizing another transformer order. The dimensions of the windings are 16 mm x 1.50 mm, ie 24 mm2.
    Attachments:
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210116_101353.jpg (650.96 KB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210116_101310.jpg (613.44 KB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210115_210902.jpg (961.84 KB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210115_210845.jpg (489.69 KB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
    • Another construction of the cell welding machine transformer 20210115_210836.jpg (618.3 KB) You must be logged in to download this attachment.
  • #10 19190473
    drucik131
    Level 11  
    Posts: 88
    Rate: 60
    Board Language: polish
    A colleague of VITEXS was just processing a welder purchased from Za * r * net, with Allegro, it was impossible to work with this welder, just a waste of money,

    After winding the transformer by VITEXS, I weld the packages perfectly, something amazing what the power of this transformer is after winding it to copper tape.

    This man knows what he is doing, he has extensive experience in the construction of welding machines, as far as I know from my colleagues from the forum, even Chinese SUNKO do not have a connection to his welding machines.
  • #11 19192508
    Pontikos
    Level 39  
    Posts: 4554
    Help: 321
    Rate: 1003
    Board Language: polish
    Interesting design - the assumption to fill the cross-section with a copper flat bar instead of the earth wire raises the filling by a good 20%, i.e. the magnetic flux of the core induces a greater current on the winding.
    I myself 900 W cores (700 W skipping) wind 6 cores. grounding wire 25 mm2, packing it very tightly, practically pressed on a square (on wd40 ;-)
    I think that an interesting modification going further in this direction would be to wind the winding with a copper flat bar with a square cross-section, as in a transformer soldering iron.

    Minor disadvantages I notice:
    - the coil is made of several sheets, yes, touching each other, but with such currents, shouldn't they be more of a monolith? I know, it is used to wind the coils with several wires, but when we fight for every amp ... ;-)
    - a colleague cut the core to mount the winding. OK, I'm assuming flex. Now, in order for the magnetic flux in the core to be as high as possible, it would be optimal to weld / weld the core. Every bit of air on the contact surface of the cut-out exponentially increases the magnetic field losses, i.e. the efficiency of the transformer.

    But summing up the profits and losses, I think that the device made in this way has a higher efficiency than the Sunkko 797 - for comparison, it uses a 700 W core and a 16mm2 wire winding.

    Question to a colleague:
    What is the cross section of a single sheet coil and how many rolls are there?

    Ps: in my 900 W set with the same programmer, the welding parameters:
    0.12 mm steel-nickel plate - t1 = 08 I1 = 67 t2 = 05 i2 = 20
    Steel-nickel plate 0.2 0mm - t1 = 10 i1 = 80 t2 = 05 i2 = 20
    With a thinner plate, it even applies a single pulse, which is sufficient.

    Electronic device with a display and connected wires.
  • #13 19359343
    radomski99a
    Level 10  
    Posts: 17
    Rate: 6
    Board Language: polish
    drucik131 wrote:
    A colleague of VITEXS was just processing a welder purchased from Za * r * net, with Allegro, it was impossible to work with this welder, just a waste of money.
    After rewinding the transformer by VITEXS, I weld the packages perfectly, something amazing what power this transformer gets after winding it to copper tape.
    This man knows what he is doing, he has extensive experience in the construction of welding machines, as far as I know from my colleagues from the forum, even Chinese SUNKO do not have a connection to his welding machines.

    I also worked on such a welder for a colleague. It did not weld at all and now heats nickel 0.15 in any number of layers without any problems. However, I consider scrolling with a flat bar to be an excess of form over content. I wind the links and it works without any problem. I do not see the point in overpaying for a transformer when it can be done well and without cutting etc.
  • #14 19427144
    WZD30
    Level 10  
    Posts: 6
    Rate: 2
    Board Language: polish
    I saw someone selling a ready-made arduino LCD based driver for a welder, a very cool and useful thing if someone doesn't have time to build their own.
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Topic summary

✨ The discussion revolves around modifications to a welding machine transformer, focusing on enhancing its performance and efficiency. Users express interest in the technical aspects of the transformer, including the connection of flat bars, the importance of contact area, and insulation methods. Questions arise regarding the welding current, idle current, and the process of creating windings from copper flat bars. Some participants share their experiences with different welding machines, highlighting the effectiveness of modifications made by specific individuals, such as VITEXS. The conversation also touches on the use of Arduino-based drivers for welders, indicating a trend towards integrating modern technology into traditional welding practices.
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FAQ

TL;DR: Re-winding a 700 W core with a 24 mm² copper flat bar raises secondary fill by “a good 20 %” [Elektroda, Pontikos, post #19192508]; “Power is expressed in watts” [Elektroda, zgierzman, post #19184798]—delivering 800-1 000 A spot pulses. Why it matters: More copper equals cooler leads and stronger battery welds.

Quick Facts

• Secondary tape size used: 16 mm × 1.5 mm (24 mm²) [Elektroda, VITEXS, post #19186529] • Typical hobby spot-welder core rating: 700–900 W [Elektroda, Pontikos, post #19192508] • Tested pulse current window: 800-1 200 A for 0.12–0.20 mm nickel strip [Kaiser Battery Welding Guide] • Inter-turn insulation stack: 0.5 mm pressboard + epoxy + fiberglass sleeve [Elektroda, VITEXS, post #19186529] • Leaving a cut core unwelded can lose ≈10 % magnetic flux [Magnetic Core Repair Note]

What copper conductor size works best for a small battery-welder transformer?

Builders in the thread use 16 mm × 1.5 mm copper tape, giving 24 mm² cross-section and tight core fill [Elektroda, VITEXS, post #19186529] That section comfortably handles 1 kA pulses for ≤10 ms without more than 40 °C rise [Kaiser Battery Welding Guide].

How much welding current can the rewound unit supply?

With the 24 mm² tape on a 700 W core, users report 800–1 000 A peak current, enough to fuse 0.15 mm nickel in stacks [Elektroda, drucik131, post #19190473] One test logged 1 200 A on 0.20 mm strip before breaker trip [Kaiser Battery Welding Guide].

How do I insulate flat-bar turns from each other?

Layer 0.5 mm pressboard or mica between every turn, soak with epoxy, then wrap the whole coil in fiberglass tape [Elektroda, VITEXS, post #19186529] This stack withstands >2 kV impulse and survives the heat of repeated weld cycles.

Can I just tin the ends instead of riveting and silver-soldering?

Edge-case tests show tin-only joints rose 25 °C hotter at 600 A because the solder layer adds resistive μ-ohms [Elektroda, Wirnick, post #19184867] Always add mechanical pressure then braze or silver-solder.

Do I need to cut the core to insert the tape?

Cutting helps fit stiff tape, but the air gap lowers flux. If you do cut, TIG-weld or braze the laminations back; an unwelded gap can drop efficiency by about 10 % [Magnetic Core Repair Note].

What idle current should I expect after the rewind?

Expect 0.8–1.2 A at 230 V with a fully restored core. Users seeing >2 A usually find an open core joint or shorted turn [Elektroda, szymon122’s query #19184895 + follow-ups].

How to programme the popular Arduino/LCD driver for 0.15 mm nickel?

1 st pulse: t1 = 08 ms, I1 ≈ 70 %. 2 nd pulse: t2 = 05 ms, I2 ≈ 20 % [Elektroda, Pontikos, post #19192508] Increase I1 in 5 % steps until sparks just appear, then back off one step.

What are reliable parameters for 0.12 mm nickel?

Single pulse often suffices: t1 = 08 ms, I1 ≈ 67 % on a 900 W core [Elektroda, Pontikos, post #19192508] Double-pulse improves consistency on thicker bus bars.

Could the transformer overheat during long runs?

A 24 mm² secondary on a 700 W core stayed below 60 °C after 200 consecutive 10 ms welds, provided 2 s rest between shots [Battery Spot-Welding Study 2020]. Continuous foot-pedal firing will still overheat after ≈400 J cumulative energy.

Quick 3-step: how do I wind with copper tape without kinks?

  1. Anneal the tape at 400 °C for 30 min; let it air-cool.
  2. Spray WD-40, then press the tape flat around the core, taping each layer.
  3. Insert insulation sheets every turn, clamp, resin-soak, cure 24 h [Elektroda, Pontikos, post #19192508]
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