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We are building our own NAS server

kassans 39174 128
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  • #61
    procsa
    Level 30  
    chemik_16 wrote:

    t610 is still on oem clone e350 - old cpu, 40nm.
    Two months ago there were smaller counterparts - Dell Wyse Dx0D for PLN 7
    I also have a few. drags 9W after kernel load. It can go up to 20W. With this efficiency, it is an average economic creation.
    the advantages - it starts from 10v - can be connected to the battery ;)


    Yes, but I am looking to connect more disks, the T610 goes to connect 3 disks.
    I got interested in "Thin Client" only a few days, I already ordered for testing for PLN 16 with "Wyse C00X" shipment :) I'm interested in what it can achieve network speed, stability, power consumption, etc.



    Maybe you have something better at a similar cash register that I can accept / buy? although who wants to play parcels when the total sum of interest is PLN 15, of which PLN 9 is a parcel; p

    Generally, in the age of small nas, mini computers or even android boxes converted to NAS, creating a server from a PC part is unacceptable to me, unless someone does not take into account the power consumption :)


    pawelr98 wrote:
    In the times of Freenas, one flash drive was starting to leave this world and the system could go crazy.
    It was only in the fresh air that he returned to normal.


    I confirm that the flash drive is completely unsuitable for the system, maybe with a converted controller, or rather its software, although the flash drive will always have a memory chip of worse quality than the SSD.
  • #62
    chemik_16
    Level 25  
    pawelr98 wrote:
    I will play with this combination with blocking SMbus.
    I have to see if it would be possible to run it on a laptop then.
    I have a broken laptop and a mPCIE-> PCIE X16 grommet from China.
    I plugged in the GPU, it worked.

    I do not think that the SM bus in it was brought out at all. RX + - TX + - CLK + - and ground, no more needed ;)

    procsa wrote:
    Wyse C00X

    I used to have a metal can with this C7, Definitely not a speed demon, but I watched this south park in SD h264 and surprisingly it worked; p TDP of the CPU itself is 9W (AVG 1W boasts), and the performance is 1/3 of the first atoma. 90nm ...

    of the larger ones, the T620 will be a class better - especially with a 4-core prock. Only something hasn't been there lately.

    These thin clients do not take less power than their ATX counterparts - it's always better to buy the latest platform and underclock it, or even better to limit the CPU usage by software - because sometimes we will need a lot of computing power - some backup / rsync - so why not deprive it of it.
  • #63
    Andrzej Ch.
    Level 31  
    Returning to my thread, this is a small update of what I wrote yesterday because I just forgot to add that for some time my freenas has been booting from a 16GB SSD disk purchased on our home shopping portal. I bought two additional such disks (in the case of W) on a foreign purchasing portal. SSD drive connected to USB 3.0 through a bay with a SATA USB 3.0 adapter
  • #64
    procsa
    Level 30  
    Andrzej Ch. wrote:
    Returning to my thread, this is a small update of what I wrote yesterday because I just forgot to add that for some time my freenas has been booting from a 16GB SSD disk purchased on our home shopping portal. I bought two additional such disks (in the case of W) on a foreign purchasing portal. SSD drive connected to USB 3.0 through a bay with a SATA USB 3.0 adapter


    Just out of curiosity, are these stimulants? I wonder how many hours worked, it would be possible to do a test write and read these disks, because I can see that they are for pennies to buy, the only question is what are they worth, I have one 8GB sandisk and if the reading is about 150mb / s, the write is only about 50mb / s. .

    As for the seagate, I had 4 Barracuda ES.2 1TB each and unfortunately all 4 of them fell apart when running around 40,000 hours; /

    I have been using WD from green to blue, black, red purple for some time and they haven't let me down yet!
  • #65
    Andrzej Ch.
    Level 31  
    This SSD from the Polish shopping portal was new, originally packed from what I remember as a spare part for ACER laptops. the rest of the (mechanical) disks I also had new, shop-based ones, they have been working for me for 3 years without a break, without any problems, and I started when I had Freenas 8 or 9 (single-digit).
    It was nice once WD used in monitoring, i.e. it was generally supposed to be a super disk for continuous operation (I still had Synology DS212j at that time), but it fell apart after 2 years.
    The drives I have now run at maximum energy saving.
  • #66
    procsa
    Level 30  
    With seagate I had a decent SV35 series, fast and strong, but also power-hungry;

    Can you provide the model of this 16GB SSD?
  • #67
    Andrzej Ch.
    Level 31  
    HDD enclosure: ORICO seen from the NAS as "TO External USB 3.0".
    Sandisk 16GB SSD drive SDSA5AK-016G KN16G0D004, This is the model used in Acer Chromebook. If I'm not mistaken, it's on the MLC's bones.
    In China, on the other hand, I bought a 16GB Kingdian or Kingspec model, also according to the assurances from the description on the MLC bones
  • #68
    chemik_16
    Level 25  
    we also have a lot of it from all kinds of terminals, o they only have a picture saved once, the system works in ramdisk.
    I've already got 3 of them.
  • #69
    Bojleros
    Level 16  
    Andrzej Ch. wrote:
    1. Inter-Tech IPC SC-4100 Server Enclosure, Black
    2. Gigabyte GA-H97N wifi motherboard


    Did Intel with cooling fit without problems? For me, the standard fan and heat sink did not go up high and I had to improvise ....
  • #70
    Andrzej Ch.
    Level 31  
    Only server cooling enters the case, even the lowest cooling does not enter there.
  • #71
    pawelr98
    Level 39  
    This then would mean that the SAS card would not work with such a laptop at all.
    I checked it without any modifications, it did not start.

    But I'll check if these connections are there. It doesn't hurt to try.

    Thin client is so good that it is usually already factory-prepared for passive cooling and low power consumption in idle state.
    On the other hand, it is usually not possible to play undervolting.
    Generally for some simple applications as much as possible.

    Is it worth buying the latest platform?
    In my opinion, the one that offers the best ratio of efficiency and power consumption to price.
    In relation to a used Celeron, the savings will amount to a few / a dozen zlotys a month and it will pay off only after 2-4 years.

    You have to do the same as the author, which is a relatively modern platform but as cheap as possible.
    It has a chance to pay off in less than a year and that makes sense then.

    In my case, I would have to be sure that the SAS card would work.
  • #72
    chemik_16
    Level 25  
    Don't overdo it with this 'repayment' either. It's always better to put together something yourself for the sheer pleasure and desire to get to know - if you look only from an economic point of view, electronics as a hobby would not exist - a handful of elements usually cost more than the final product from China.

    pawelr98 wrote:
    o then it would mean that the SAS card would not work with such a laptop at all.
    I checked it without any modifications, it did not start.

    do not forget that the laptop has cards approved on whitelist - this is not why bios modules to insert a different WLAN card than the manufacturer wants.
    I do not know a card that would need a smbus to work, those from LSI also certainly work with pcie 1x, I do not know about these p400
  • #73
    pawelr98
    Level 39  
    This laptop talked to the Ati X600 PCIE card.
    Some random power cables and modems worked too.

    I suspect there is no whitelist there. This is some second generation Dell i5.
    It has no keyboard and is a bit shabby. It seems to have three mPCIE slots.

    I look at the economy because the progress in the field of computers has slowed down anyway.
    The differences are rather cosmetic. Why overpay?
    In addition, I feel satisfaction when I find the used equipment well on the occasion and then it serves for years.

    My NAS was created mainly because of poor internet. You can spread the download around the clock and there is quick access to all files. I do not feel internet failure too much. And it happens that "yes" from 7Mbit / s will become 3-4.

    This economy is like "I have photovoltaic and electricity for free". Only first you had to put in a lot of cash, which would be enough for many years of paying the electricity bill.
  • #74
    chemik_16
    Level 25  
    I have an e5430, ivy in my workshop, so you probably have 5x20. Practically the same.
    there is a list on the bank, I modded the bios to insert a third-party 3G card, it only supported 1 model. The GPU might not be subject to the restrictions, after all, there were also versions with dedicated cards.
    there are 3 sockets but 1 for WLAN (size 1/2), 1 for WAN / 3G (full) and 1 for the | TPM module - I don't even know if it's pcie.
    And remember that you have the most convenient option available - expresscard ;) you can easily make any card
    We are building our own NAS server We are building our own NAS server

    edit:
    if someone wants a ready - 6dyskowy this is a promo -50%, 1.4k PLN
    Netgear ReadyNAS RN 426
  • #75
    CC_PL
    Level 11  
    Quote:
    pendrive - usb 2.0 (3.0 quickly went down: /)


    I just read something that these newer / faster flash drives fall faster. What is the cause of this?
    On unRAID sites, they recommend 2.0 flash drives, not the newer / faster ones.

    @ chemik16 - NetGear falls well in the promotion (not anymore). On the plus side, there is ATOM and not ARM. However, the software is said to be weak, compared to Synology and QNAP.
  • #76
    LubMich
    Level 12  
    Let me add to the topic ... there are questions about home NAS - i.e. quite effective device .. without special performance requirements ..

    When it comes to software .. freeNAS requires a strong machine - I have not seen anyone mention OMV here https://www.openmediavault.org/
    It is based on debian .. can also be uploaded to an installed Debian.

    When it comes to hardware, I took a different route than those mentioned here, my NAS by assumption replaced the router immediately .. maybe the security purists will nod .. but company routers without software update will be more dangerous than 1 device for both purposes.

    I put on the APU2 board (https://pcengines.ch/apu2.htm) in my case, APU2C4, exactly supplemented with a 32GB SSD drive, as I remember, a 2xSATA card (currently available 3xSATA external and 1xSATA for SSD), and a wifi card .. and of course the disks .. I bought some Toshiba (p300) 3tb. the equipment has been in operation for about 3 years .. I took out all the magnetic disks from my home computers .. finally everything in one place. The equipment calmly saturates the 1 Gbit link ... after OpenVPN, of course, something less .. but I did not make any more precise measurements. I did not want to play with the aggregation of the second LAN port - usually only one person works and in a normal computer also max is 1 Gbit.

    The APU itself is strongly focused on optimizing power consumption and should satisfy 6-10W.


    here are some photos in progress:
    We are building our own NAS server
    We are building our own NAS server
  • #77
    Andrzej Ch.
    Level 31  
    CC_PL wrote:
    Quote:
    pendrive - usb 2.0 (3.0 quickly went down: /)


    I just read something that these newer / faster flash drives fall faster. What is the cause of this?
    On unRAID sites, they recommend 2.0 flash drives, not the newer / faster ones.


    USB 3.0 pendrives very often overheat, hence they fall faster.
  • #78
    chemik_16
    Level 25  
    CC_PL wrote:
    @ chemik16 - NetGear falls well in the promotion (not anymore). On the plus side, there is ATOM and not ARM. However, the software is said to be weak, compared to Synology and QNAP.

    you can probably upload some generic x86 norms on it - e.g. OMV. It's basically a normal x86_64 + ECC platform.

    LubMich wrote:
    I bet on the APU2 board (https://pcengines.ch/apu2.htm)

    It's hard to get this apu, it's nowhere to buy. Not to mention stimulants.
  • #79
    LubMich
    Level 12  
    Well, there will be many stimulants .. hardly anyone sells ..
    but the new ones are available without any problems .. in Poland:
    PL Interprojekt.pl ALIX, CF, MPCI, POE, enclosures
    PL LPN Plant APU
    PL Pluscom ALIX, CF, POE, MPCI, enclosures

    I bought at pluscom:
    https://www.pluscom.pl/plyty-glowne-c806.html
  • #80
    chemik_16
    Level 25  
    and only they have something. rest OUT-OF-STOCK. Or rather, they will have it in 12 days ;)

    CPU - amd jaguar - the same as in terminals after 2014, the mentioned hp t620, e.g.
  • #81
    LubMich
    Level 12  
    As a rule, I do not even know if the APU has a weaker processor because it is clocked at 1GHz ... I do not know how with AES-NI support .. apu has, so the vpn encryption is quite functional .. and here you have a 3x1gbit network application without any unnecessary graphics and quite universal 2x pcie that allow you to make us pretty cool. And the device is new .. with some sort of guarantee of reliability.
  • #82
    dawciobiel
    Level 12  
    Bojleros wrote:
    I have Asrock on J2900 with 16GB of RAM and I'm pissed off because sftp doesn't reach 33MB / s ... sshd is choking on cpu. Equipment sufficient, but sometimes annoying.

    Then maybe you have a problem, because I have:

    - CPU
    Quad-Core AMD Opteron (tm) Processor 1352 (2.1GHz)
    64 bits
    - RAM: 3 GB
    - Disks:
    - SATA Seagate ST4000DM004-2CV1 (4 TB)
    - SATA Seagate ST3000DM001-1ER1 (3 TB)
    - LAN 1 Gb / s
    - OS: linux x64 (for about 10 years. No matter what - security issues gentlemen). I used to have FreeBSD for many years (another 5-10 years or so). Admittedly, BSD has its pros and cons.

    Although I have not tested via FTP, however, after LAN (SMB) copying files often goes 50 - 80 MB / s and when saving to the server.

    Added after 3 [minutes]:

    Karaczan wrote:
    Do not use only EXT4 on NTFS shared drives.
    NTFS support is more resource-intensive than EXT4.
    The CPU will take some weight off and the transfers will increase!

    Additionally, ext4 is very resistant to defragmentation - unlike NTFS.

    Added after 28 [minutes]:

    pawelr98 wrote:
    (...)
    As for privacy. What are they going to do? That I am downloading music and series from the Far East with transmission blocked.
    Legally legal, if I shared it they could do something there, although questionable. So far, the companies from there can only politely ask the websites to graciously stop sharing.
    Only in "their" area they can, for example, arrest the owners of the sites.

    I worked with remote access. But after the initial enthusiasm, I found that I didn't really need anything there. With a transmission of 60-80KB / s, I will not even download anything from the outside in a reasonable time.

    A simple patent from Hamachi, installed on Linux and connected to one network with other computers.

    I have external IP variable and I did not want to think about it. I set up game servers at most and gave the current IP.


    Regarding the download / sharing of music via peer2peer - a good friend of mine had a case with us in the country. He was sharing an album by some Polish group. So they can. But as you noticed, you do not share, and even if they are not Polish works. And rightly so.

    And if they were, I recommend creating an encrypted partition (for example the free LUKS). And if necessary, claim that more than one person has access to the server - because many people cannot be convicted for one crime at the same time. So it's important that nobody admits.
  • #83
    LubMich
    Level 12  
    No, after smb you have no encryption ... sftp is completely encrypted at 33MB / s. By encryption it works .. again in the local network you do not need to encrypt .. and outside you have to have a good connection ... even for 33MB / s

    It sends me over 90MB / s after smb.

    From the filesystem I got interested in brtfs. It's great for NAS and it's great .. especially sbapchots on the fly and with the appropriate configuration after smb from the window level, the content of any file or folder can be restored.
  • #84
    dawciobiel
    Level 12  
    LubMich wrote:
    No, after smb you have no encryption ... sftp is completely encrypted at 33MB / s. By encryption it works .. again in the local network you do not need to encrypt .. and outside you have to have a good connection ... even for 33MB / s

    It sends me over 90MB / s after smb.

    From the filesystem I got interested in brtfs. For NAS and it's great for .. especially snapschots on the fly and with the appropriate configuration after smb from the window level, the content of any file or folder can be restored.


    Well, I have encryption, but not at the SMB level, but at the disk partition level using LUKS (I recommend).
    But I will not comment on the encryption load of the CPU because I never paid attention to it.

    Added after 4 [minutes]:

    Oh, I forgot to add that another issue that I strongly advise against NTFS on the server is that:
    - Its encryption is deceptive and can be easily circumvented on this file system.
    - More fragmented files than ext4
  • #85
    Bojleros
    Level 16  
    dawciobiel wrote:
    Then maybe you have a problem because I have ...


    Classically it chokes on cpu because, for example, I can run a second sftp session and in total I have some less than 70MB / s and two cores are at 100%. Probably AES support in cpu would help.

    LubMich wrote:
    No, after smb you do not have encryption ...


    Residual weak and outdated Microsoft brands. Another thing is that this protocol has always been a backwards-compatible pad.

    dawciobiel wrote:
    It sends me over 90MB / s after smb.


    Then get NFS for yourself. I have 110MB / s and in addition less cpu load. Only at the expense of the actual lack of encryption of the LAN connection and of a fairly simple access model. Kerberized nfs is not so light anymore.
  • #86
    kassans
    Level 32  
    Boileros what are you achieving 110mb / s on? :D For me, on freenas or xigmanas a ZFS formatted disk on average 25mb / s; /
  • #87
    dawciobiel
    Level 12  
    Bojleros wrote:

    Then get NFS for yourself. I have 110MB / s and in addition less cpu load. Only at the expense of the actual lack of encryption of the LAN connection and of a fairly simple access model. Kerberized nfs is not so light anymore.


    Ok, interesting suggestion - I'll be interested in the topic tomorrow morning.
  • #88
    Andsa
    Level 11  
    I have been playing with my home NAS for a long time and like one of my colleagues I use openmediavault. (PSMB, Plex, Nextcloud). Initially, I used an Atoma-based board with 4 disks. This configuration worked for two years, but transcoding in Plex was dropping due to low performance.
    Currently, there are 5 disks in the server casing and a regular motherboard based on I5 and DDR4. It's not as energy-efficient as ATOM, but it's not too bad. Power consumption is 40-60W. When it comes to OMV, YT has a lot of resources on how to configure plugins and dockers on this system.
  • #89
    LubMich
    Level 12  
    kassans wrote:
    Boileros what are you achieving 110mb / s on? :D For me, on freenas or xigmanas a ZFS formatted disk on average 25mb / s; /
    freenass has high system requirements .. such a result is, to say the least, weak ... I have such a 90MB / s without problems .. maybe around 100 also appear with some larger file .. 110 is probably even higher than 1 gbit can give ? but it will also depend on the protocol ..

    I don't use transcoding ... I prefer a stronger playback device and a lighter one ... but it's a matter of configuration.
  • #90
    Karaczan
    Level 41  
    I am surprised why you have such low transfers that you are surprised when someone has normal ones ;)
    I have an average of 80-90MB / s on my home Xeon L series folder on LGA775 and 4GB of RAM.
    Of course, over the cable, much less after WiFi. Ok 30MB / s, but that's the old N300 WiFi.
    3x500GB 3.5 "+ 500GB 2.5", no RAID. EXT4, No encryption, because what do I need in the home network ...
    SMB transfers, a bit more after FTP, around 100MB / s